Pick ups. Grass is always greener....

[Telenic]

Like most guitarists, no matter how good a stock guitar is I always assume that it can be improved with better pick-ups. I have had a new Prospect for about 3 months and am extremely happy with it. I believe it has stock Schaller pick ups. The sound is pretty good but could be improved especially with articulation in the bass.

 

For three months now I have been scouring this forum, You-tube, and other on-line sources to see if there is any way to make an educated guess as to whether or not another pick up could improve the sound of my guitar, and precisely what that sound would be. Unfortunately there is no consistent information, opinions, or sound bytes that can help with this decision. The HRW's are almost impossible to get any information on.

 

After looking carefully at Lindy Fralin Pure PAF's, Seth Lovers, and HRW's, I'm starting wonder if the Schallers are really just as good. And I wonder why Heritage would use Schallers if they weren't a pretty good pick up.

 

I'd like to get stories and opinions from other Heritage owners who have gone through the process of making the decision to change their pick ups and how they feel about the results.

 

I'm also wondering if anyone knows why Heritage chose Schaller for stock pick ups.

[Kuz]

There are better pickups, in my opinion.

 

The problem is you didn't say any of the following:

 

-What type of music do you play?

-Do you play mostly clean, a little dirt, classic rock/blues, or modern metal?

-What amp do you use?

-What is your budget?

-Do you want brighter pups, creamy/sweeter, or darker tone?

 

The list goes on and on....

 

But to just say are there better pickups, well yes & no depending on your application.

[Telenic]

There are better pickups, in my opinion.

 

The problem is you didn't say any of the following:

 

-What type of music do you play?

-Do you play mostly clean, a little dirt, classic rock/blues, or modern metal?

-What amp do you use?

-What is your budget?

-Do you want brighter pups, creamy/sweeter, or darker tone?

 

The list goes on and on....

 

But to just say are there better pickups, well yes & no depending on your application.

 

Very clean and full but I like to crank in just a touch of dirt. I play a lot of finger style jazz and some blues. I use a DRRI exclusively, and there is no budget (thought $500 Throbakcs are a little too pricey).

 

But I'm not really asking anyone to suggest a pick up, I don't think that's possible. I'm really more interested in how people came to a pick up purchase decision and whether or not that decision worked out.

 

I know Telecaster pick ups inside and out and would typically buy a pair of pick ups I like and then go buy a Tele to pop them in to.

[MartyGrass]

I used to look down on Schallers for the same reason given: there must be something better. I now find Schallers to be fine. They really can give that nice Schaller tone.

 

I'm serious here. They're decent PAFs- a bit bright perhaps.

 

Look at this from Heritage's perspective. They need to put some pickups in their guitars. They probably got a favorable arrangement with Schaller as a package for hardware and pups. And Schaller makes very good stuff.

 

No matter what pups Heritage chooses, some will be unhappy. At least Heritage allows you to custom order almost any pup.

[ingeneri]

Aren't all the new humbucker equiped guitars using Duncans now?

 

I'm swapping out the neck Schaller on my Super Eagle for a Seth Lover. The Schallers are fine, I've put off modding this guitar for 3 1/2 years because I can't stand not having it available while it's in the shop. But I do think they get a bit muddy. Looked at boutique stuff, but went with the Seth's since that's what Wolfe features these days.

[DetroitBlues]

I'm a fan of Gibson and Seymour Duncan pickups. I know there are many more out there, but these are pups I can find on production guitars. I've gone into a music store like Guitar Center knowing which guitars have specific pickups I want to try out. From there I demo the guitar on the same model or similar amp that I currently use. This helps me to hear the guitar's pickups as if I was playing at home. Skips all the online videos and I can hear the pup with my own ears. I took the schallers out of mine and bought some Seymour Duncan pups for my H-140.

[Kuz]

Very clean and full but I like to crank in just a touch of dirt. I play a lot of finger style jazz and some blues. I use a DRRI exclusively, and there is no budget (thought $500 Throbakcs are a little too pricey).

 

But I'm not really asking anyone to suggest a pick up, I don't think that's possible. I'm really more interested in how people came to a pick up purchase decision and whether or not that decision worked out.

 

I know Telecaster pick ups inside and out and would typically buy a pair of pick ups I like and then go buy a Tele to pop them in to.

 

OK, so now we have a baseline.

 

For me, THROBAKS were worth every penny. There is a thread where FxDx Randy just validated what I said that THROBAKS are the best PAF style pickup. They are very articulate, clear, smooth, creamy, and NO ice pick. I have one set in my Custom 555 and another in my "Greeny" 150.

 

 

For less money, as a close second are Tom Short handmade pickups. I have two sets of his Marc Ford Buckers. Great PAF pickups for around $250 a set. They really are a steal.

 

I also really like Peter Florence Voodoo '59s. Probably the best bridge pup out there in the PAF style, but the neck pup is a tad dark. His go for around $300-350.

 

I also like Lollar imperials which to me are a more expensive version of Tom Short's pups. Lollars maybe have a little more low end on the neck and maybe a little closer to the Peter Florence bridge pup. Lollars go for $300-350.

 

I feel we play similar styles, although I don't play as much finger style except for comping. Since you are ask about a pup for a semi hollow Prospect, I really recommend the Throbacks. I tried 4 sets of pups in my Cust 555 and the THROBAKS were by far the superior pup for that guitar- bigger, rounder, more 3D.

 

If you have any other questions don't hesitate to ask.

 

Good luck and enjoy the hunt!

[djg714]

Sometimes it takes a little adjustment to get a better sound. For me it took lowering the Seth Lovers on my 535 to get a warmer sound.

[peteraltongreen]

Here's my 2 cents worth of pick up selection :

When I bought my C140CM in 1986/7 time,there were a few things,I thought that could be improved for me.Pups,the fitting of a standard stop bar,set to the correct height,and the wiring seemed,to me to be the wrong way round.When I turned up the volume,it all came on between 1 & 3 on the dial,then little else to 10.So,I had new U.S.A made pots fitted ( professionally ) to fix this. Now,the volume is more even to 10.Pups wise,I went for Seymour Duncan '59's.These pups suit my style,which is old time Rock 'n Roll,to light Jazz & big band playing.They were not as 'harsh' or aggressive as the Schallers.I now have a great guitar with loads of sustain,great sound into my Fender amps,and great quality pots to manage the sound.My H575 I left stock,as it performed great as is.Complete happiness !

Peter Alton Green

[DetroitBlues]

Here's my 2 cents worth of pick up selection :

When I bought my C140CM in 1986/7 time,there were a few things,I thought that could be improved for me.Pups,the fitting of a standard stop bar,set to the correct height,and the wiring seemed,to me to be the wrong way round.When I turned up the volume,it all came on between 1 & 3 on the dial,then little else to 10.So,I had new U.S.A made pots fitted ( professionally ) to fix this. Now,the volume is more even to 10.Pups wise,I went for Seymour Duncan '59's.These pups suit my style,which is old time Rock 'n Roll,to light Jazz & big band playing.They were not as 'harsh' or aggressive as the Schallers.I now have a great guitar with loads of sustain,great sound into my Fender amps,and great quality pots to manage the sound.My H575 I left stock,as it performed great as is.Complete happiness !

Peter Alton Green

 

Did you replace the tailpiece and add a pickup selector cover to yours? I have an '85 and it has a Schaller tailpiece and no selector cover...

[fxdx99]

But I'm not really asking anyone to suggest a pick up, I don't think that's possible. I'm really more interested in how people came to a pick up purchase decision and whether or not that decision worked out.

 

Hey TeleNic - so, I came to my decision to swap pickups based on how I wanted a specific guitar to sound thru the amps that I use. I've 2 Heritage semis and one 150 that I've done this on. For the first semi, it had Schallers, I mostly played it thru a PR and DR and it was 'too clear, too... 'behaved' for me. A bit bright, didn't drive the amp like I wanted. I tried Seth Lovers and stopped there as I got lucky and found 'the sound' I wanted with them. A bit more drive/dirt, still clear tho. For 2nd semi, that guitar accentuates the bass especially in the neck position, but I really liked the bridge voicing. Started with SD59s and took a couple swaps until finding a Phat Cat neck and leaving the SD59 in bridge fit what I wanted (the Phat Cat providing that more single coil brightness/snappiness). For 150, started w/SD59s and didn't care for them at all. Sounded constipated, flat in that guitar. Tried BareKnuckle Stormy Mondays and they worked well and I liked them. But, had a pair of Throbaks (posted this in thread Kuz is referring to) and love 'em. Worth the money imho.

 

In the end - for me it's trial and error, hit/miss. Think the trick is matching pickup to guitar. Not sure I could select a humbucker set and just grab a guitar to put them in. I've not found that pickups are the dominate voicing in a guitar, but that the guitar itself is. Pickups of course play an important part and for me seth lovers are a safe choice (work well for blues/classic paf sounds in most guitars) and Throbaks are a premium pickup that will sound great to magnificent in most all guitars. Phat Cats are a unique choice that sound fantasitc in Prospects... I know as I played tulk's (HOC member) w/Phat Cats and it's a fantastic guitar voicing (and I'd go on a limb and say if you like teles, you'd probably really like a Prospect w/Phat Cats - I'm in that camp).

[mtpatty]

For my personal taste...I prefer Bare Knuckle Pickups...i find that with the various models, i can get what I want on a more consistent basis... It seems that the Mule/Emerald combination and the Abraxas set are my current favs...Having said that, I am keen on the Suhr Aldrich bridge pickup as well...

[BrianToth]

I think I'm usually the odd man out. I have no guitars with humbuckers. I just don't like them. I have Lindy Fralin P-92s on both my Prospect and my Sweet 16. The Fenders I own have single coils of course.

[NoNameBand]

There are better pickups, in my opinion.

 

The problem is you didn't say any of the following:

 

-What type of music do you play?

-Do you play mostly clean, a little dirt, classic rock/blues, or modern metal?

-What amp do you use?

-What is your budget?

-Do you want brighter pups, creamy/sweeter, or darker tone?

 

The list goes on and on....

 

But to just say are there better pickups, well yes & no depending on your application.

 

 

I agree with Kuz but would add that it depends on your wallet too. To suggest that some pups are better than others depends on all the things stated above and money. I believe that Heritage puts the best pickups they can in the guitars for the price and general application.

 

Pickups from Seymour Duncan are of the best value and make some great pups. Then, the Lollar, Fralin & Sheptones are all very good. Then you can step up to Tom Holmes at $750.00 a pair and everything in between. Great pups through basic or factory electronics will have limitations that can be freed up by upgrading these first. This is the first place to start in mu opinion, then if you still can't get the tone you want, call and speak to Lindy Fralin, Jason Lollar, Roy at RS Guitarworks or even Seymour Duncan directly. They are all very knowledgeable about their craft and can explain things that will make sense to you for your style, guitar and application. In the end, this may help you with your choice.

[Joey]

Like most guitarists, no matter how good a stock guitar is I always assume that it can be improved with better pick-ups. I have had a new Prospect for about 3 months and am extremely happy with it. I believe it has stock Schaller pick ups. The sound is pretty good but could be improved especially with articulation in the bass.

 

For three months now I have been scouring this forum, You-tube, and other on-line sources to see if there is any way to make an educated guess as to whether or not another pick up could improve the sound of my guitar, and precisely what that sound would be. Unfortunately there is no consistent information, opinions, or sound bytes that can help with this decision. The HRW's are almost impossible to get any information on.

 

After looking carefully at Lindy Fralin Pure PAF's, Seth Lovers, and HRW's, I'm starting wonder if the Schallers are really just as good. And I wonder why Heritage would use Schallers if they weren't a pretty good pick up.

 

I'd like to get stories and opinions from other Heritage owners who have gone through the process of making the decision to change their pick ups and how they feel about the results.

 

I'm also wondering if anyone knows why Heritage chose Schaller for stock pick ups.

 

After staying with the stock Schallers in my H555 for over 15 years, I finally made a change to Fralin Pure PAFs. "Oh my God" I can't believe I didn't make this change sooner. The tone is clean and while being warm. I was particularly blown away by the neck pick up clarity compared to the the Schaller's which now by comparison were muddy. When you play a chord, you hear each string with great articulation. This change makes my guitar very versatile doing a great job with jazz/, blues or rock. In addition, this guitar sound great through all of my amps. I did a lot of research prior to deciding on the Fralin's including classic '57,s Duncan '59's Seth Lovers. Go to the Fralin site where he does really good demos on all of his pups. Make sure you use headphones or a really good computer speaker system to get a good idea of the sound and tone. Good luck on your tone quest!.

[DetroitBlues]

The real point is try out some similiar guitars with different pickups. You'll have to start experimenting. Good news is you'll end up being an expert with a soldiering iron.

[cram1960]

My 535 sounds so good as it is, I'm scared to dismantle it to try new pickups.

I don't know what they a re, and I don't care.

 

I guess I'll just have to buy another 535 and mess with that one.

[DetroitBlues]

swapping pups in hollow and semi-hollow bodies are tough because of access.

[Telenic]

I want to thank everyone for some great insights. I just bought a set of Bare Knuckle Stormy Monday's. I've had good luck with Bare Knuckle in the past and the Stormy Monday demos seemed about perfect.

[DetroitBlues]

I want to thank everyone for some great insights. I just bought a set of Bare Knuckle Stormy Monday's. I've had good luck with Bare Knuckle in the past and the Stormy Monday demos seemed about perfect.

 

Best of luck with those, I've heard a lot of people like them. If you manage some demo's, let us hear them!

[Telenic]

Best of luck with those, I've heard a lot of people like them. If you manage some demo's, let us hear them!

 

It would be the first time I taped myself, but maybe I'll try.

[peteraltongreen]

Did you replace the tailpiece and add a pickup selector cover to yours? I have an '85 and it has a Schaller tailpiece and no selector cover...

Yes,I fitted a good quality ( Schaller ) stop bar.I found the Schaller end stop with the little hinges took away some of the sustain,so I fitted a Schaller fine tuning end stop.Still not the best,so the standard,solid stop bar was fitted to the correct height..Heaven !*

The Seymour Duncan '59's came with nickel covers,which I prefer to open coils,anyway.Most or the music I like was done on '50's gear,i.e.,Scotty Moore,Tal Farlow,Johnny Smith,Kenny Burrell etc.They either used P90's or P.A.F's (Generally) The Seymour's mimic this perfectly to me.

So,originally my C140 had open coil Schaller pups,and the end stop with individual hinged string anchors for each string.

* It is important to set the stop bar to the correct height.Don't screw it tight down to the body.If you need to know how,contact me again,and I'll explain how to do it.

Peter Alton Green

[Blunote]

Peter, I for one would be interested in you thoughts on stop bar height. I've adjusted mine to be high. It makes for easier bends.

 

That's about all I know though.

[kidsmoke]

Peter, I for one would be interested in you thoughts on stop bar height. I've adjusted mine to be high. It makes for easier bends.

 

That's about all I know though.

 

 

There's another thread going regarding this topic. Any experienced input would be great.

[Telenic]

Yes,I fitted a good quality ( Schaller ) stop bar.I found the Schaller end stop with the little hinges took away some of the sustain,so I fitted a Schaller fine tuning end stop.Still not the best,so the standard,solid stop bar was fitted to the correct height..Heaven !*

The Seymour Duncan '59's came with nickel covers,which I prefer to open coils,anyway.Most or the music I like was done on '50's gear,i.e.,Scotty Moore,Tal Farlow,Johnny Smith,Kenny Burrell etc.They either used P90's or P.A.F's (Generally) The Seymour's mimic this perfectly to me.

So,originally my C140 had open coil Schaller pups,and the end stop with individual hinged string anchors for each string.

* It is important to set the stop bar to the correct height.Don't screw it tight down to the body.If you need to know how,contact me again,and I'll explain how to do it.

Peter Alton Green

 

You wouldn't by chance be the Peter Green from Fleetwood Mac would you?