barrymclark Posted December 30, 2011 Posted December 30, 2011 http://kemper-amps.com/page/render/lang/en/p/158/do/Kemper_Profiling_Amplifier___Guitar_Amplification_Redefined.html This is just crazy. You have to read it. I don't know what the extent of this amp is... but the idea is incredible.
bolero Posted December 30, 2011 Posted December 30, 2011 great!! with things like this & the axe fx etc, no one needs real amps anymore..I'll take them off your hands, thank you very much
JeffB Posted December 30, 2011 Posted December 30, 2011 Im waiting for the Kemper to arrive. Should be 2 weeks. I was told that 2 weeks ago. 2 weeks!!!!. Till Ive tried it and used it I got nothing of value to say about it. Ive seen the idiot threads on other forums. No one except for a few testers tried it and everyones a freaking expert. Ive liked some of the clips Ive heard but then Ive also liked some axfx and pod hd500 clips so it means nothing. The other good thing thats good news for us over here is the price parity to the rest of the world which makes a change. A really pleasant change.
barrymclark Posted December 30, 2011 Author Posted December 30, 2011 yeah... I am wary of what you are talking about Tully. I don't care for this "I got a secret" mess.
JeffB Posted December 30, 2011 Posted December 30, 2011 The idea appeals to me in that I have some amps I like. The Egnater tourmaster has great crunch and reasonable high gain 3rd channel that I really like. The Mesa LS has a nice clean and fluid solo, the Koch has some great low gain sounds. None of the sounds I like out of each amp can be found in the next amp or if they can its not quite right. I love a strat through a JCM800 with the preamp just at 1/2 way. etc etc. It would be cool to capture those sounds under my own terms rather than have some manufacturer give me a list of presets to work with. I just think with the internet sharing capabilities It would fun and a nice way to build up a catalogue of sounds to use. So many amps I cant try and if the kemper lives up to expectations I could have sampled sounds from some one who has that amp. Ultimately Im a realist and expect I will still be using my Fender Concert and a few stomps to play mustang sally and sweet home Alabama down at the local bar not the Kemper it I decide to buy it. I pondered the axfx but I would be more comfortable and will derive more pleasure(and frustration) from messing around capturing and cataloguing sounds. It interests me more. In much the same way as I build and buy stomps and amps etc. Its just a form of cataloguing.(stamp collecting) So if the Kemper works out to be the real deal or close enough to cool after a little experimentation, I will be grabbing it.(no longer "buy then try". Now, "try then buy"...or not)
smurph1 Posted December 30, 2011 Posted December 30, 2011 One mans opinion..Tweakability, being able to take vintage tones on the road..Line 6 anyone?
JeffB Posted December 30, 2011 Posted December 30, 2011 One mans opinion..Tweakability, being able to take vintage tones on the road..Line 6 anyone? I already have line6, korg, Boss, Digitech etc etc. They cant do what the Kemper does, or what they say it does. Its a different kind of toy. It gives you the ability to make your own amp modelling rig. Theoretically you should be able to model/profile the line6, boss, fractal etc stuff with the kemper. Even stompbox's I suppose. How real it sounds and how amp like it feels, if it does, will be what sets it apart from line6 etc. People are taking possession of them right now so the jury will deliver its verdict over the coming days, weeks and months.
barrymclark Posted December 30, 2011 Author Posted December 30, 2011 One mans opinion..Tweakability, being able to take vintage tones on the road..Line 6 anyone? I already have line6, korg, Boss, Digitech etc etc. They cant do what the Kemper does, or what they say it does. Its a different kind of toy. It gives you the ability to make your own amp modelling rig. Theoretically you should be able to model/profile the line6, boss, fractal etc stuff with the kemper. Even stompbox's I suppose. How real it sounds and how amp like it feels, if it does, will be what sets it apart from line6 etc. People are taking possession of them right now so the jury will deliver its verdict over the coming days, weeks and months. ... Line6 can't even do what the Axe-FX does, to be honest. Axe-FX is what Line6 promises to be. I played and tweaked Line6 amps and PODs for years and just couldn't get it where I wanted them. Their is just something in their idea of amp voice that I just can't get along with. (the Fractal thing can be tweaked to hell and back. It is actually rather impressive and their customer service is seemingly pretty amazing.) ...again, this is without trying the DT50 or something that isn't having problems. I can honestly see that for a metal setup and for general bass, me just having a direct Axe-FX rig and having the Starlite for clean tone gigs or where the classic look is required then the Cube for a more portable 'everything' amp.
blackjack Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 I already have line6, korg, Boss, Digitech etc etc. They cant do what the Kemper does, or what they say it does. Its a different kind of toy. It gives you the ability to make your own amp modelling rig. Theoretically you should be able to model/profile the line6, boss, fractal etc stuff with the kemper. Even stompbox's I suppose. How real it sounds and how amp like it feels, if it does, will be what sets it apart from line6 etc. People are taking possession of them right now so the jury will deliver its verdict over the coming days, weeks and months. From what I've seen online of the Kemper crowd, it's the real deal. You should be very happy with the claims. The questions I'm interested in are: Does it have a lifelike feel to it, and are you comfortable twiddling it at the local bar? I think it would be cool if the answer turns out to be "yes". In one of their instructional videos he starts out saying something like "It's not just convolution..." implying that it's not only spectral analysis, that they also have something patentable. That may be just to help scare away the big corps who will be looking to copy it. This box characterizes the reference amp by inputting signals that include the impulse (an amplitude spike), sine waves swept across the frequency spectrum, and white noise. Basic frequency analysis, and enough math to scare most engineers away. Check out Fourier, who invented much of this, while working for Napoleon. It's no mystery, but now this level of processing is affordable in a box, and studios and some travelling pro's will make good use of it. It's the middle class that will make the difference in sales (sound familiar?).
JeffB Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 From what I've seen online of the Kemper crowd, it's the real deal. You should be very happy with the claims. The questions I'm interested in are: Does it have a lifelike feel to it, and are you comfortable twiddling it at the local bar? I think it would be cool if the answer turns out to be "yes". In one of their instructional videos he starts out saying something like "It's not just convolution..." implying that it's not only spectral analysis, that they also have something patentable. That may be just to help scare away the big corps who will be looking to copy it. This box characterizes the reference amp by inputting signals that include the impulse (an amplitude spike), sine waves swept across the frequency spectrum, and white noise. Basic frequency analysis, and enough math to scare most engineers away. Check out Fourier, who invented much of this, while working for Napoleon. It's no mystery, but now this level of processing is affordable in a box, and studios and some travelling pro's will make good use of it. It's the middle class that will make the difference in sales (sound familiar?). The designer of the product has been making high end, well respected synth gear for a long time now so Im sure hes put a lot of thought into this and it isnt just a bang it out product. His reputation is on the line in some ways. It is a very user dependant product in so many ways so I am expecting the plug in and play crowd to write some pretty scathing reviews. Its a product that suits a certain side of me even though I will probably still use my amps for 90% of my playing time. But yes, feel and response will be the thing that defines it. I know a guy who runs straight into a Digitec something and then straight to the desk and has done for years. Great player and sounds that fit what he does. He cant stand the way a tube amp feels. He just likes ss or digital. (he can be quite obnoxious and elitist about it ) I cant really fault his sounds and he works some pretty nice gigs. I guess Im saying there are people who dont find tube amp and speaker feel to be desirable but they might like some of the sounds a tube amp delivers.
yavuz Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 Is this an actual amp or pre-amp? Do you connect speakers to it? It looked to me like you connect it to a power amp or P.A. If that is the case, I find it very hard to believe that it can do what it says. For this to actually work as advertised, the unit would have to know what you are modeling as well as what you are playing it thru live. This way it can ( may be ) do the right amount of compensation. The best would be to have a special amp and a speaker to be able to deliver what the modeled after amp has. I think this is where DT25/50 has an advantage... Even though it would not work as advertised, if it has playable nice sounding choices, that would be enough for me to consider it.
JeffB Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 Is this an actual amp or pre-amp? Do you connect speakers to it? It looked to me like you connect it to a power amp or P.A. If that is the case, I find it very hard to believe that it can do what it says. For this to actually work as advertised, the unit would have to know what you are modeling as well as what you are playing it thru live. This way it can ( may be ) do the right amount of compensation. The best would be to have a special amp and a speaker to be able to deliver what the modeled after amp has. I think this is where DT25/50 has an advantage... Even though it would not work as advertised, if it has playable nice sounding choices, that would be enough for me to consider it. Its a preamp of sorts. There are clips of it at work on youtube and about a hundred threads about it on the gear page. No one really had one but they talked endlessly about it anyway.(much like Im doing now) If you have a singular sound as an ideal and are happy with what you have there would not be much fun in a kemper for you. If you like recording and cataloguing/collecting new sounds I think it would be a fun/useful thing to own particularly if you have access to multiple different amps. Now that they have finally released the product we will find out what the general guitar population thinks of it and have some real reviews instead of just a few Beta testers thoughts and 100,000 opinions from people who have no experience with it.
yoslate Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 You seem to have a pretty good sense of what's up with it, Jeff (given that you haven't put hands on one). I watched everything available on Kemper's page and a lot of the demos on Youtube last night. Seems it might be a great piece of professional or semi-professional studio equipment. Me? I want to see a jeweled pilot light and some tubes glowing, as any one of my boxes sits at idle, before a set....
Guest HRB853370 Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 I am holding out for a Patriot amp, as soon as I can find one. The heck with all these Korean and Chinese modeling pieces of junk. JMO.
barrymclark Posted December 31, 2011 Author Posted December 31, 2011 I am holding out for a Patriot amp, as soon as I can find one. The heck with all these Korean and Chinese modeling pieces of junk. JMO. Careful, Will. Not all Korean or Chinese made amps are POJ. Two brands come to mind. One being a solid state modeller and the other being a straight up tube amp. In both cases, they will both probably last as long of not longer on the SS as any handwired US amp without any need for repair or tube replacement and the other is every inch as easy to repair or mod should it need it. As well, not all modellers are made overseas. In fact, the forerunner of the bunch is made in the US. That being the Fractal Audio Axe-FX. This item, though, isn't a modeller, to be accurate. It's a profiler. If it works, for a recording musician or even a recording engineer that has a TON of gear he likes to use can simply profile the tones he/she likes and take them where ever in one small box. That is very cool to me. I love technology. After all, the guns you stick by were once technologies not so well accepted. Of them all though, I'd say the FAS Axe-FX is the one opening eyes and hearts. Even the most diehard of my tube-loving friends are getting these for professional use and dumping their tubes save for maybe one that has sentimental value or something or is necessary for one reason or another. After the Starlite, I gotta say that the Axe-Fx is on my radar. Long range radar, but radar. Keeping the Cube for portability, the Starlite for awesome and gigs where SS amps will get you tossed and the Axe-FX for EVERYTHING! On top of that, a 150 set up pretty much like Skolnicks is on the shorter range radar.
Guest HRB853370 Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 Bad assumption I made Barry-you are so correct. Just because I have no interest in modeling technology whatsoever, and my comments were driven by ignorance. I do support good gear, whatever it happens to be, that is engineered and made in the USA, just like you do. But that is a whole other subject for another thread. When Line6 came out, I was in a band and some of the guys got some of it and it looked cheesy and cheap to me. Maybe it got better I dunno. I suppose the Line7 is an improvement over the previous version too. I need to become a better player first, thats my main goal. Processing, FX and modeling won't do that for me. You have to remember-I don't own an IPOD and I still spin vinyl!
TalismanRich Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 I was checking out the Kemper web page and listening to the Robin Gallagher clip, Tele-pathy. After a couple of runs through it, I thought.... LORDY! I wish I could pick like that. Didn't even pay attention to what the amp sounded like, or if it simulated a tweed or blackface, Or maybe it was an original 52 tele with a 50 year old amp. WHO CARES. Sorry... we were talking about hardware..... never mind!
JeffB Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 I am holding out for a Patriot amp, as soon as I can find one. The heck with all these Korean and Chinese modeling pieces of junk. JMO. Yeah, well, its made in Germany.
blackjack Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 Kemper users will most likely have "sampling parties". They'll meet up at someones house, bring a couple of boutique amps and all sample them, and one person might first go to Guitar Center and buy a Marshall stack and they'll sample it as well, and the next day he'll return it cause they all ripped it, and that was the plan all along. Similar to music file sharing, except the intellectual property is the amp profile.
Kuz Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 just my quick take on the modeling stuff. I have tried all the Line6 stuff and briefly own a line6 Live and one of theLine 6 amps. I also briefly owned and returned the 11Rack. The the Axe-Fx changed my mind and life towards modeling units! The Axe-FX FOR RECORDING is indistinguishable to recorded amps. But for live use, I have no experience, and personally would/will only use the real thing.... Tube amps. But for recording, the modeling stuff (in my case the Axe-Fx) has made it so much easier with equal results.
LK155 Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 So how much is one of these magic boxes? And how do you use it if you don't have access to all those cool boutique amps you want to emulate? Can it produce files that can be moved from one Kemper to another? Or sold by one Kemper user to another?
JeffB Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 Well, yes, for sure, no two ways about it. No one complains about strat, tele, LP copies or fender and marshall clone amps or ts, ds1, Klon clones too much. Not to many people get upset about Line6 etc whose industry is based on trying to emulate amps. Fractal, according to some pretty much nail the amps they are modelling. Kemper are just putting the tools to do it in the hands of any one who wants to do it.
JeffB Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 So how much is one of these magic boxes? And how do you use it if you don't have access to all those cool boutique amps you want to emulate? Can it produce files that can be moved from one Kemper to another? Or sold by one Kemper user to another? You will pretty much be able to file share by email with anyone who has a kemper and an amp you want. (I think) Kemper have a forum under construction so I guess they will have a file sharing section or something. Just gotta repeat, Im not sold on it yet as I havent tried one. I just like the idea of it. If its a fail its a fail.
Kuz Posted December 31, 2011 Posted December 31, 2011 The talk over at the Fractile Axe-Fx website is that it will be less expensive than an Axe-Fx but more limited in abilities compared to an AF. You can also share files over a HUGE data base of Axe-FX users. I download the patch I think sounds interesting and then tweak it to my taste. This save a lot of time then from starting from scratch. Also the Fractile forum has reported that the Kemper unit is 8 months behind when it was stated to be released and there could be a problem with the functioning of the Kemper unit. Others are saying Kemper is just taking their time and working the bugs out. Who knows???
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