MartyGrass Posted June 25, 2012 Posted June 25, 2012 After the frustrating refusal of PayPal to hold the seller liable for cosmetic damages to the guitar (see previous threads), I submitted the claim to FedEx. By phone FedEx said they have no responsibility for damage to a fragile item that was not properly packed. This guitar was shipped in the case only without any internal or external packing or boxing. I sent all of the photos to FedEx. In a stunning reversal of fortune, FedEx ruled that they are responsible for the damage and will cover the costs of restoring the guitar. Some may say that all's well that ends well. But this still impresses me as unfair. The only sense of justice I get is the scathing feedback I left for the seller.
FredZepp Posted June 25, 2012 Posted June 25, 2012 wow.. this is the neverending story.. Hopefully this time we achieve a good result and are done.. finally. best wishes for a satisfactory result this time.
DetroitBlues Posted June 25, 2012 Posted June 25, 2012 The only sense of justice I get is the scathing feedback I left for the seller. To which Ebay really tries to prevent you from doing.
pegleg32 Posted June 25, 2012 Posted June 25, 2012 So much for Ebay's buyer protection program. Glad Fedex is going to pick up the cost, but it would seem that they are not really at fault here. I guess chalk it up to experience and move on.
Keith7940236 Posted June 25, 2012 Posted June 25, 2012 I'm anxious to see pictures when the repair work is done
sakis26 Posted June 25, 2012 Posted June 25, 2012 The whole thing you went through is something no one can pay you for.I hope that will be a happy ending after all to your story MG.
Spook410 Posted June 25, 2012 Posted June 25, 2012 Thanks for giving the rest of us insight into questionable Ebay/Paypal business practices. As for the unscrupulous seller, there is some truth to 'what goes around comes around'.
MartyGrass Posted June 25, 2012 Author Posted June 25, 2012 Thanks for giving the rest of us insight into questionable Ebay/Paypal business practices. As for the unscrupulous seller, there is some truth to 'what goes around comes around'. When I bought the guitar, I looked up his address on Google Maps. Let's say he's among the top 1%. I then Googled his address and found the home was valued over a million dollars. Then I looked at his eBay purchasing history- deep sea fishing gear and other expensive toys. So I felt better knowing that since he's rich he must be miserable, too. Isn't that how it works?
Fernando Posted June 25, 2012 Posted June 25, 2012 He could be rich, the same way he could be drowning in debt. Either way, I think the way he "packed" the guitar was a complete disgrace. I still cringe every time I remember it.
GuitArtMan Posted June 25, 2012 Posted June 25, 2012 I've gotten so nervouse shipping stuff I always overpack. Most times it's in the case, with a little extra padding in the right places, bubble wrap and/or peanuts, inner box, more bubble wrap and/or peanutes, outer box. I like the fact that many manufacurers are using boxes with standoffs in the cornes so that the case if kind of suspended in the box.
Steiner Posted June 25, 2012 Posted June 25, 2012 I'm anxious to see pictures when the repair work is done I'm more anxious to see the pictures when it comes up for sale.
bolero Posted June 27, 2012 Posted June 27, 2012 one thing I never ever use are packing peanuts...they fall into holes, compress & settle during shipping...and end up not supporting/protecting the gtr nearly as well as a solid piece of foam would
Blunote Posted June 27, 2012 Posted June 27, 2012 I think the seller is liable for the damage. The law requires buyers and sellers to take reasonable care when they handle, store or convey goods. In my view, this seller did not. But, since he lives out of state, you'd have to pursue the case in Federal court. The practical reality is that the it would cost more to pursue than the guitar's worth.
Guest HRB853370 Posted June 27, 2012 Posted June 27, 2012 When I bought the guitar, I looked up his address on Google Maps. Let's say he's among the top 1%. I then Googled his address and found the home was valued over a million dollars. Then I looked at his eBay purchasing history- deep sea fishing gear and other expensive toys. So I felt better knowing that since he's rich he must be miserable, too. Isn't that how it works? Rich perhaps and not a lick of common sense. For future reference, Ebay's Buyer Protection excludes damage due to packing (or lack thereof)? I don't buy expensive stuff on ebay anymore, but still would like to know what their fine print says.
MartyGrass Posted June 27, 2012 Author Posted June 27, 2012 Rich perhaps and not a lick of common sense. For future reference, Ebay's Buyer Protection excludes damage due to packing (or lack thereof)? I don't buy expensive stuff on ebay anymore, but still would like to know what their fine print says. You won't see any fine print about it. I read the details in print and discussed them with several PayPal dispute experts. Sending a FedEx shipping label to the seller, which I did, is viewed as a local pickup of the purchased item. There is no buyer's protection with local pickup. If the seller bought the same shipping label from FedEx, it would not be considered local pickup. This is an arbitrary decision by PayPal. To their credit, they recognized that it wasn't what I wanted to hear and acknowledged that it doesn't necessarily make sense or seem fair. But they explained that they have to draw a line somewhere. I've gotten over it.
Blunote Posted June 27, 2012 Posted June 27, 2012 I think you mis-titled the OP. The final chapter will be once you get the repaired guitar back from Heritage and start enjoying it!
MartyGrass Posted June 27, 2012 Author Posted June 27, 2012 So I thought it was over. Not so! This morning I received an email that stated PayPal found one of the faxes I sent supporting my claim. I ignored this third such email that they want to take yet another look. A few minutes ago I got another email saying they reversed their decision and found the seller at fault. They said they gave me a partial refund. I checked and they haven't but... I feel a little bit better about the world
Bonefish Posted June 27, 2012 Posted June 27, 2012 It's not surprising or atypical for ebay to assume ownership transferred at the time of shipment since you made the shipping arrangements. This is fairly standard practice and something we should all be aware of when purchasing items online. Many years back I worked in supply chain management and transfer of ownership was a pretty big deal both with regards to liability and inventory (on account of taxes). When you are paying shipping and handling, you are paying the fee for them to ship a product to you, but they are responsible for the item until your receipt. When you provide a FedEx account number or you make arrangements for pick-up, then you assume ownership at the time the product is picked-up by the shipper. That's why it's always best to let the seller handle shipping, even if it means a little more cost for you. (there are exceptions to these principles, but they are the general rule of thumb)
Tallershadows Posted July 2, 2012 Posted July 2, 2012 That is great news. I hope you received your refund by now. Any idea why the decision was reversed? Also, I hope you are planning on posting some photos when the guitar returns from the shop.
MartyGrass Posted July 2, 2012 Author Posted July 2, 2012 I really have no idea why the decision was reversed. I don't have reason to trust the information I'm receiving from any parties involved, myself and Heritage excepted. PayPal has closed and reopened the dispute many times. It was once again closed for the final time mid last week and I was promised payment within 24-48 hours. I never received that payment. Friday I was promised it within 24 hours. Saturday I was told that it would be another 24 hours. This morning I was told I'd have it by tomorrow morning. I asked why the decision to give me a refund was reversed in my favor. The answer was that I was a good, longstanding customer, not that I was right and deserved it. I pushed harder for clarification but got rhetoric about how they value me. I tried another angle- Is the seller going to pay the $200 to PayPal for my refund? More Washington speak. They cannot rule that out, but that has nothing to do with me. So then where is the money coming from that I'm getting? PayPal values my long history with them and is rewarding that with a $200 credit. So I gave up trying to understand whether the money I've been promised is just a gift or due to a meritorious claim. They state it is the former. I will definitely post pics of the fully restored Millie.
H Posted July 2, 2012 Posted July 2, 2012 I have it on good authority that Bernanke is getting his personal crayons out to make you a couple of $100 bills from the latest round of quantitative easing.
MartyGrass Posted July 2, 2012 Author Posted July 2, 2012 I have it on good authority that Bernanke is getting his personal crayons out to make you a couple of $100 bills from the latest round of quantitative easing. Bernanke is clever alright, but I think he got his inspiration from Dan Aykroyd. Read this from 1978. http://snltranscripts.jt.org/78/78dcarter.phtml
NoNameBand Posted July 2, 2012 Posted July 2, 2012 Good for you MG. The Karma thing may have something to do with it. I hope it all works out for the best.
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