KSquared Posted July 3, 2012 Posted July 3, 2012 I figure some of you experts can help me diagnose this mystery with my 535. It's not a crisis, just a little strange. I changed strings recently, didn't change gauge or anything, just a new set of the 10s I always use. When I tuned up, I noticed the action is much lower and buzzing. It was fine immediately before the string change. I'm not super anal about such things but this was a very noticeable difference. My original setup was close to the Gibson spec of 5/64" low E and 3/64" high E, measured at the 14th fret. After this string change, the low E was at 3/64" and the high E at 2/64". My first thought was that this would relate to a truss rod tightening I had done several weeks ago, without first removing the strings (I did loosen them), back when the humidity was still low from the winter. However, this was not my first sting change since then (maybe the third). And there was still enough relief in the neck. Thus, I raised the bridge a little, and moved on. It seems stable again. The humidity around here (Philly burbs) gets really high in the summer, but I would think that would raise the action, not lower it. None of my other guitars, including some sensitive acoustics, have been affected. So, I'm curious, anyone have an opinion on what happened? Is there some basic maintenance or trick I'm missing? Thanks for any input.
barrymclark Posted July 3, 2012 Posted July 3, 2012 Just so I can say it was asked, did the bridge height change? Bump the thumbwheels or anything?
davesultra Posted July 3, 2012 Posted July 3, 2012 Did you change 1 string at a time, or the whole shebangy-bang?
KSquared Posted July 3, 2012 Author Posted July 3, 2012 Just so I can say it was asked, did the bridge height change? Bump the thumbwheels or anything? I don't think so. But it's possible. I wasn't being super careful (or the opposite), just trying to change strings in 5 minutes or less . . .
KSquared Posted July 3, 2012 Author Posted July 3, 2012 Did you change 1 string at a time, or the whole shebangy-bang? whole shebang -- I loosen them one by one, then cut and remove
Gitfiddler Posted July 3, 2012 Posted July 3, 2012 Different string brands can have an effect on your set up. Or your 535 could just need time to adjust. Wood is like that.
LK155 Posted July 3, 2012 Posted July 3, 2012 The humidity around here (Philly burbs) gets really high in the summer, but I would think that would raise the action, not lower it.... My experience has been the opposite. Humidity here in winter is very low, and in summer can be well over 80%. Currently 75% in the room that houses my guitars. So truss rods get adjusted a couple of times per year. When the humidity goes up, my mahogany necks will tend to straighten out and become flatter, lowering the action. In fact, I can usually tell just by the action getting low enough to cause string buzz that it's time for a truss rod tweak. I have three guitars with maple necks, and none of them is affected nearly as much.
yoslate Posted July 3, 2012 Posted July 3, 2012 Wood is like that. Wood never dies...is always alive. Sometimes it's very moody and contrarian. It follows its own "logic." Work with it.
davesultra Posted July 3, 2012 Posted July 3, 2012 whole shebang -- I loosen them one by one, then cut and remove Suddenly removing all the string tension, coupled with the changes in humidity very well could have had an affect on the guitar.
High Flying Bird Posted July 3, 2012 Posted July 3, 2012 whole shebang -- I loosen them one by one, then cut and remove This happened to me on the 357/Firebird. I changed the height of the post when wiggling the bridge out of place. It also happens on the 137. From now on I am just changing one string at a time.
Kuz Posted July 3, 2012 Posted July 3, 2012 First thing I do when I know I will be removing all the strings to clean the fretboard (the only reason I remove all the strings) is to use painters tape to tape down the stoptail studs and the TOM thumb wheels. I will also take down the intonation screws so NOTHING MOVES. You didn't realize it but the thumb wheels can EASILY move with all the strings off. I would bet anything that is what happened. Having all the strings off for 5 mins should not have had any impact on the truss rod. I take my strings all off (after everything is taped down) and scrub the fretboard, then restring. About 45mins of having the strings off the guitar and I have never had to adjust the truss road because all the strings were off the guitar for a short time. The thumb wheels turned.
KSquared Posted July 3, 2012 Author Posted July 3, 2012 First thing I do when I know I will be removing all the strings to clean the fretboard (the only reason I remove all the strings) is to use painters tape to tape down the stoptail studs and the TOM thumb wheels. I will also take down the intonation screws so NOTHING MOVES. You didn't realize it but the thumb wheels can EASILY move with all the strings off. I would bet anything that is what happened. Having all the strings off for 5 mins should not have had any impact on the truss rod. I take my strings all off (after everything is taped down) and scrub the fretboard, then restring. About 45mins of having the strings off the guitar and I have never had to adjust the truss road because all the strings were off the guitar for a short time. The thumb wheels turned. In hindsight, I think you're probably right. I have a lot more experience tinkering with Fender-style guitars. My 535 is my first and only guitar with G-style hardware; I didn't realize the bridge was so susceptible to moving around. Thanks.
sykofiddle Posted July 3, 2012 Posted July 3, 2012 This is why I compromise - 3 at a time off/3 new ones on, turn the guitar around and repeat. Give you access to cleaning the fretboard, but keeps tension on the bridge and saddles.
Spectrum13 Posted July 3, 2012 Posted July 3, 2012 Did not see it mentioned... you got a locking bridge?
pushover Posted July 4, 2012 Posted July 4, 2012 How old were the strings you replaced? My experience is that strings stiffen up as they age and so if any adjustments were made with old strings on, changing to a new more lively set will often introduce buzz that wasn't there with the old set. My solution to this problem was just to change strings more regularly.
DetroitBlues Posted July 8, 2012 Posted July 8, 2012 I know on my old H140, the bridge and tailpiece moved way too easliy. Perhaps yours did the same?
tbonesullivan Posted July 9, 2012 Posted July 9, 2012 how is the relief on the neck? That's usually the first thing I check when I notice an action problem. I keep it so that when the string is fretted at the 1st and 13th fret, a thin pick or standard playing card will fit between the string and 5th fret. If that has changed, that could be the issue. When you adjusted the truss rod, did you loosen the strings or "pre bend" the beck when your hands? What may have happened is that the truss rod was not able to "work" as well with the strings on, but when the tension was released, it "jumped" bit.
Guest HRB853370 Posted July 9, 2012 Posted July 9, 2012 Where do you get the tools to measure the string height? Stew?
Guest HRB853370 Posted July 9, 2012 Posted July 9, 2012 Wood never dies...is always alive. Sometimes it's very moody and contrarian. It follows its own "logic." Work with it. Is that kinda like "rust never sleeps"?
Trouble Posted July 9, 2012 Posted July 9, 2012 First thing I do when I know I will be removing all the strings to clean the fretboard (the only reason I remove all the strings) is to use painters tape to tape down the stoptail studs and the TOM thumb wheels. I will also take down the intonation screws so NOTHING MOVES. You didn't realize it but the thumb wheels can EASILY move with all the strings off. I would bet anything that is what happened. Having all the strings off for 5 mins should not have had any impact on the truss rod. I take my strings all off (after everything is taped down) and scrub the fretboard, then restring. About 45mins of having the strings off the guitar and I have never had to adjust the truss road because all the strings were off the guitar for a short time. The thumb wheels turned. That's what I was thinking, I change all mine at once too so I can wipe everything down. I've never had any problems except for moving the thumbwheels, I usually just go over all aspects of the setup with new strings on. I've never taped them, but I keep my hands on them when I get close to them with a rag.
tbonesullivan Posted July 10, 2012 Posted July 10, 2012 Where do you get the tools to measure the string height? Stew? Definitely stew. They have a nice little handy action gauge that can also be used to measure stuff like pickup height, etc. If you are REALLY anal about setup you can get the feeler gauges to set the relief, but I just use the playing card method or eye ball it. Heck stewmac has everything, except for truss rod tools that will fit a Hamer Diablo.
DetroitBlues Posted July 10, 2012 Posted July 10, 2012 A set of feeler gauges from an auto parts store should work too. Usually the ones you use for spark plug gaps.
Trouble Posted July 10, 2012 Posted July 10, 2012 A set of feeler gauges from an auto parts store should work too. Usually the ones you use for spark plug gaps. Cheaper too, anything that is labeled for musicians or instruments is more expensive. I like StewMac but some of the prices blow my mind.
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