kidsmoke Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 AS lurkers here no doubt are aware, I've been suffering with AAS for a while, flip flopping back and forth on what type of circuit may best get me where I'm looking to go. Part of the problem is that I've not played on a variety of amps for decades as many of you. So when a compelling amp comes along, I read up on it, do lots of youtube trolling, try to compare it to the sounds I AM familiar with, and........don't bite. Rinse, repeat. the latest fantastic option is a 5F1 Champ build. This was built by a friend who is very much like our own KBP810, a skilled and knowledgeable bloke who does this sort of thing extensively for others, every now and again for himself, and then sells that item off, and builds something else. this champ is true to '57 spec, in a beautiful tweed cab, with leather handle etc etc. only exception is it's got a 10" weber rather than an 8" Jensen. I'm thinking about it because I feel that it affords me exposure to one of the "classic" benchmark tones in electric guitar history, I know this guys workmanship, and the price is reasonable. But still, It's coin. I mean, there's that 140 lurking around here.....etc etc... So here's what I'm asking....that those of you familiar with this circuit can offer critique and recommendations... as in: here's what I found = x - y - z found I didn't need/want it and why or.. I'd jump on it and why thanks in advance! relevant considerations - I'll be playing a PAF loaded 535, a tele, and a P90 loaded LP through it
PunkKitty Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 Don't let a 10" Weber speaker push you away. That's an upgrade to the Jensen IMHO. It sounds like a good deal. Tell me more tonight.
kidsmoke Posted October 12, 2012 Author Posted October 12, 2012 Don't let a 10" Weber speaker push you away. That's an upgrade to the Jensen IMHO. It sounds like a good deal. Tell me more tonight. agreed! this is one thing that makes it more appealing to me. When do you expect to have yours? I'm thinking I can launch the peggy for this...but I'm skeered......
PunkKitty Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 I need to buy some screws to mount the chassis to the cabinet. I plan to do that tonight on my way out for the evening. I should get it set up tomorrow.
DetroitBlues Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 That's a tough call... But really you cannot go wrong with a Champ or a Tweed Deluxe circuit. Of all the amps KBP has built over the past couple years, only one has remained in his stable. A Tweed Deluxe in a custom made cabinet 1x12. All of his amps are 1x12 or larger... I suggest a head cabinet... Being a 5F1 amp, its a really small circuit that can fit in a real portable, lunch box sized head cab...
fxdx99 Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 Hey Kip - that sounds like a nice amp. I like the late 50s circuits like Champs and Deluxes. To me, kinda the same tweed voicing, just different volume levels. While it's been debated on which amp was used, I always thought that the Layla Clapton tone was a strat thru a Champ. Somewhat of a 'one trick pony' amp as even it's cleans have a bit of hair on them. They overdrive really really well and at a fairly reasonable volume. Very musical power tube crunch. Like the idea of a 10" in one over the 8" for a bit more presence and low response. Is it a desert island amp? Maybe for some, but I like the blackface circuit the best personally as it 'holds together' a bit better for better clean voicing (my favorite gigging amp is a blackface deluxe reverb based amp). But I do like a tweed in the stable. I've a 5e3 and a Gibson '56 GA6, both of which are 'tweed sound' and use them often. Single coils especially sound wonderful thru them, especially a tele! Humbuckers hit the front end harder and overdrive quicker (think Larry Carlton's sound on Steely Dan records he played on for what a 535 thru it might sound like... it's a 335 thru a 5e3, but they're very similar). http://mr335.tv/?channel=steely&videofile=mr335/steely/335blues Sounds like a really nice amp - I'd go for it if was looking to add a tweed. All the more so w/a 10" over the 8" speaker.
big bob Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 My go to amp now is built around a champ circut, modded so that I could swap between a 6v6 (what the champ has) and other tubes. I am currently running it with a 6l6 and just love the clean headroom. A champ with a 6v6 will not be as clean, it will have some grit and break up about 1/2 way there(6 o'clock ). Nice thing about a champ is either you love it or you don't. Not a lot of tweaking with just volume and maybe a tone controll. Mine has only one dial, volume. If the price is right and you like the tone, by all means, go for it.
DetroitBlues Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 That is a cool looking amp. My vote is to just have it in a head cabinet.
kidsmoke Posted October 12, 2012 Author Posted October 12, 2012 My go to amp now is built around a champ circut, modded so that I could swap between a 6v6 (what the champ has) and other tubes. I am currently running it with a 6l6 and just love the clean headroom. A champ with a 6v6 will not be as clean, it will have some grit and break up about 1/2 way there(6 o'clock ). Nice thing about a champ is either you love it or you don't. Not a lot of tweaking with just volume and maybe a tone controll. Mine has only one dial, volume. If the price is right and you like the tone, by all means, go for it. I recall that Lance, and also that you pushing some big drivers and it sounded fantastic at PSP. One of the arguments in favor...I also recall you had some pretty significant mods to the standard 5F1, including PT correct?
kidsmoke Posted October 12, 2012 Author Posted October 12, 2012 That is a cool looking amp. My vote is to just have it in a head cabinet. It has a 1/4" speaker output in the chassis, so driving a cab is doable, although access is a bit of a challenge with the panels installed
DetroitBlues Posted October 12, 2012 Posted October 12, 2012 It has a 1/4" speaker output in the chassis, so driving a cab is doable, although access is a bit of a challenge with the panels installed a new head cab isn't hard to find. You won't need that 1x8 cab...
kidsmoke Posted October 12, 2012 Author Posted October 12, 2012 a new head cab isn't hard to find. You won't need that 1x8 cab... it's a 1 x 10, but your point is noted. Part of my objective is finding a smaller amp that I'm able to do more with. I'd love to find that as a combo, it's great, and driving a variety of cabs is frosting.
212Mavguy Posted October 13, 2012 Posted October 13, 2012 This is a pretty decent build, decent parts and as is can be a great grab-n-go combo or drive a bigger cab. Winner if you like to play through it. Mine's a different circuit, but it's an absolute blast to play through.
big bob Posted October 13, 2012 Posted October 13, 2012 I recall that Lance, and also that you pushing some big drivers and it sounded fantastic at PSP. One of the arguments in favor...I also recall you had some pretty significant mods to the standard 5F1, including PT correct? Not a lot of changes, larger transformers, a slight mod to the tube socket, and a larger bias resistor.
kidsmoke Posted October 16, 2012 Author Posted October 16, 2012 as for component quality...those of you in the know...what's your take on the Classic Tone USA built transformers?
PunkKitty Posted October 16, 2012 Posted October 16, 2012 Those are the same transformers that my 5f1 uses. They are made in Chicago and they have a good reputation.
DetroitBlues Posted October 16, 2012 Posted October 16, 2012 it's a 1 x 10, but your point is noted. Part of my objective is finding a smaller amp that I'm able to do more with. I'd love to find that as a combo, it's great, and driving a variety of cabs is frosting. For the most part, I prefer combos as its quicker to move them, but I do see an advantage of separate head and speaker cabs. I can use a 1x12 at band practice and move to a 2x12 or even 4x12 for a gig....
kidsmoke Posted October 16, 2012 Author Posted October 16, 2012 Those are the same transformers that my 5f1 uses. They are made in Chicago and they have a good reputation. Dayum....I'm gettin' stoked. It's gonna be a very interesting comparison of two boutique 5F1 builds, using almost identical components, but one with 10" compared to an 8" speaker. I won't have mine for a while, but it's gonna be fun,
DetroitBlues Posted October 16, 2012 Posted October 16, 2012 What's the charge from those guys? Never heard of them before.
kidsmoke Posted October 16, 2012 Author Posted October 16, 2012 What's the charge from those guys? Never heard of them before. you mean the PT's? I can't tell you, as they are part of my finished build. Boothill's kits don't include PT's, so maybe PK knows what these (pictured) PT's run? or...you can call and ask. http://www.classictone.net/
212Mavguy Posted October 16, 2012 Posted October 16, 2012 Getting back to OP stuff, This amp getting done up right now is the gateway drug of all time for finding out what's on the backside of the glory holes guitar players have been sticking their plugs into for years and years. ANYTHING can be easily changed out that matters, even transformers. I ripped the guts out of my Silverface Champ around four-five years ago and replaced just about everything, including tube sockets and trannies. The parts that were put in were unusual for guitar amps, and the result is unusual in a good way. Fast forward to the present, for amusement I completely redid three vintage amps in the last three months, they are all stage performance monsters now from family room to medium venue sizes. It happened to me, Be careful about what you bought. It could happen to you... The addictive desire resulting in the total loss of store bought tone. Look how easy it is to swap out a tube, and there are only 3 of them, cheap date for a vintage tube roll in the clean and dirt. Uh- Ooooooh. You can drive a 2/12 or 4/12 or a 1/15 or 2/15 with it. Uh- Ooooooh. You can stick pedals in front of it and make it do wierd noises like an alien spaceship or excited farm animals. Uh- Ooooooh. You can use it to seranade farm animals. Chickens particularly love 12 string acoustic tone at parlor volumes. Uh- Ooooooh. Uh- Ooooooh. In this design, a soldering iron tip goes just about anywhere necessary to change out a part to something else to try out, like a cap, resistor, substitution, circuit mod(s), swapping out different output transformers, piggybacking a few extra filter caps for beef's sake? Uh- Ooooooh. It's not quite big enough to rest a fifth of single malt, ashtray and cigar cutter on. So it will work great as a second amp in a stereo rig with another, bigger, Chinese Swiss Army combo amp for the requisite non guilt spill table duties. It's so small and cute looking. it'll fit behind the front passenger's feet on the floor. Easy to carry. SAS. stereo or second amp syndrome, part of another sickness, the GAS complex. Beano doesn't help. Uh- Ooooooh.
kidsmoke Posted November 15, 2012 Author Posted November 15, 2012 This little baby ships out next week. Hope to spend thanksgiving weekend with it.
Blunote Posted November 16, 2012 Posted November 16, 2012 Sell everything you have and buy a Guytron GT100 FV. I'm serious.
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