bass/amp/speaker geeks assist request

[kidsmoke]

I've been wanting to get a bass for a variety of reasons. One thing that has held me back is that I then need an amp.....and well, ya'll know. I'm preaching to the choir. to plagiarize 212MavGuy...uh-ohhhhhhh

 

One thing i was told about Bass gear is that the drivers/speakers used typically have a baffle that is constructed specifically to accommodate the extra travel required of the low frequencies, and for that reason, you need to be careful what you use for this application.

 

Well I was looking for info on a 212 guitar cab that I've had for a while. It's sounds great with my Plexi oriented Lanilei amp, and I was wondering what sounds may come from it when I get my Champ next month. But the marketing indicates they could serve a bass application well. Wondering if those of you who understand the technical side of this can voice an opinion.

 

Here's the data. there's a spec chart half way down. I've got the 12" 8 ohm variety.

http://www.peavey.co...rpionseries.pdf

[212Mavguy]

You could use peavey scorpion 12's for bass no problem, although there might be better speakers fir that out there. Hartley Peavey's stuff has a rep for reliability and bang for the buck, the Scorps are no exception, I have had one for years. Good for a bright amp with a lot of sizzle to lightly tame on the top end... like a Trainwreck clone. One of these should be able to handle 75-100 tube watts. Not super efficient as many high power speakers tend to be. Give 'em some watts and they'll love you for it.

[DetroitBlues]

Thundersteel plays bass, so does Slammer, Tbone, and JackB. They might have an opinion that can help you...

[bolero]

I'm no expert, but for bass you normally want a speaker with a 4" voice coil, to handle the excursion the lower freqs need

 

you can blow/damage guitar speakers if you play above minimal volume with a bass because gtr speakers often have a 1.5-2" voice coil, plus not as robust surrounds to handle the movement

[kidsmoke]

I'm no expert, but for bass you normally want a speaker with a 4" voice coil, to handle the excursion the lower freqs need

 

you can blow/damage guitar speakers if you play above minimal volume with a bass because gtr speakers often have a 1.5-2" voice coil, plus not as robust surrounds to handle the movement

 

yes, this is what I was alluding to in the OP. These have 2.5" Kevlar coils....but they bill them as being fine for bass, although engineered for Guitar. Mind you, I'd like to be heard, but the intent isn't to wail away endlessly in a Zeppelin cover band...but to be able to play along at home and occasionally turn it up to decent volume. I'd drive it with a 33 watt head.

[Thundersteel]

Even though it says it can be used in bass applications, I'd be careful. It's not the frequencies per se, but it's the amplitude (loudness) of the signal. If a guitar speaker is played through a bass amp too loud, it WILL blow the speaker. It's best to use a speaker/bass cabinet designed specifically for bass.

[bolero]

yeah I remember using a SF twinn reverb for dual duty once, with the bass you could actually hear the speakers bottoming out/thumping on the low notes!!

 

back when I was young & stupider than I am now

 

Yorkville makes great bass combos...some ugly ( blue carpet covering etc ) but well made & sound good. not sure if you can get it in the states though? I've seen good prices used

 

http://www.directproaudio.com/product.cfm?directid=56745

 

http://www.yorkville.com/products.asp?cat=33&type=71&id=80

[212Mavguy]

In practice, the Scorpion has worked fine for bass in reasonable power situations. Technically speaking, two and a half inch VC is more than adequate when the speaker is placed in a suitable cabinet and powered sensibly. Most guitar VC's are 1 3/4 inch or less. A four inch coil, while helpful for increased bass response, is not absolutely necessary to play bass. For instance the CTS square magnet 15's used by Ampeg for many ears have a 1 3/4 -2 inch unit. I've had several of those speakers.

 

Peavey Scorpions are among the most inexpensive 12 inch speakers out there to get used, they can be found easily, as well as spare baskets. The quality of manufacturing is incredibly consistent from unit to unit, and three bolts to change out the basket if it does blow. The cone surround and spider on these are very stiff, excess excursion is not normally a problem with these speakers.. Bass response in closed back cabs is better than open back, and that closed cab takes care of any cone excursion situations, that's one small reason why HIFI cabinets are mostly sealed.

 

Speaking from the experience of owning Scorpion 10 and 12's over the years. The 10 is better for bass than guitar, and the 12 has the same motor as the 10. For the 40-50 bucks a used 12 inch Scorpion goes for that's a good place to inexpensively start filling a 2/12 with unless you like paying lots more. It's going to take a buttload of watts to blow a pair of scorpions used for bass, they are very heavy duty and heavily built speakers, much more heavy duty construction than the vast majority of guitar speakers ever made.

 

Folks can theorize all they want, in real life for this 2/12 bass application the bang for the buck factor for a pair of used Scorps is gonna be tough to beat, especially if someone already has a pair in a 2/12, go for it, and if one blows, so what? It's gonna have to be quite loud for that to happen, and plentifully cheap to replace.

[kidsmoke]

in real life for this 2/12 bass application the bang for the buck factor for a pair of used Scorps is gonna be tough to beat, especially if someone already has a pair in a 2/12, go for it, and if one blows, so what? It's gonna have to be quite loud for that to happen, and plentifully cheap to replace.

 

Therein lies the rub. I've got an original 80's Peavey 212MS Cab with these in it. Built like the proverbial brick sh*thouse. I hate having to move it! For home applications, I can't imagine I can damage it. It'd be a huge bonus if I could actually use it out, but then again...I'm not really a bassist, so that's someone else's problem!!

 

Now, I just need a bass!

 

Thanks all, for the input. I'll find something to run through this and let ya'll know if can damage 'em. If I do, you know I was having a hell of a lot of fun!