Ryantic Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Hello everyone, I'm new to the forum and I've learned a lot over the past couple of days searching the forums for information. I'm looking for some advice if anyone is willing to help out. I've been on the hunt for a good semi-hollowbody for quite some time now. I've been researching guitars, tried a few and even tried convincing myself that spending $4000+ for a Collings was somehow worth it at this point in my life. It's not. I keep coming back to The Heritage 535. I haven't gotten a chance to try one yet but one popped up on craigslist the other day and I'd be curious about anyone's feedback on it. http://newyork.craigslist.org/fct/msg/3902848214.html It seems to me he's asking a premium for the guitar. I reached out to Jay Wolfe and he agreed that it probably wasn't worth what he's asking. Also, Jay was less than enthusiastic about the HRW's and the VIP system. He seems to be of the opinion that the VIP system sucks the true tone from the guitar. I understand lots of people respect what Jay has to say so I'm definitely taking it into account but to be honest I like the idea of having a guitar that versatile. So I guess what I'm interested in is twofold...What might you pay for this guitar? Is there truly noticeable tone suckage with the VIP system? I understand both of those questions are completely subjective but I'd like to get as much information as I can to make an educated decision. I'm willing to take a chance on it but I also don't want to spend too much and then find out a month or two from now I'm not happy with it and then lose a few hundred dollars trying to resell it. Any advice is greatly appreciated!
H Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Welcome to the HOC Here's a clip of a very similar 535 being put through its paces. Tone suckage? Not sure I hear that here. I'm pretty sure you could pick up a 535 here in the For Sale section for substantially less than the one you've posted details of.
Ryantic Posted July 19, 2013 Author Posted July 19, 2013 Yeah I found that video the other day as well. I kinda thought it sounded great. Just curious of anyone's first hand experience. Thanks!
randy2270 Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 I am slightly confused as to what the seller means by had HRW installed, does this mean he has a different type in there that he/she isn't disclosing. The originals come with it, and wouldn't that be the HRW's. Sometimes people are willing to make a video of the instrument, you could ask and really low ball it <15 yrs old guitar and all> but I agree that you could get one here for cheaper and with less ambiguity.
H Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 I have a 535 and believe it to be Heritage's flagship guitar. That said, mine doesn't have coil splits/taps and the associated switching. They are hugely versatile and very well made - handmade, in fact. I doubt you'd be disappointed with a 535 but the price here is around $600 more than I'd pay for a good condition used one. You could have coil splits/taps added for a lot less than that. Here's mine.
HANGAR18 Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 What is a VIP System? Nevermind, I found it... http://www.heritageguitar.com/dvip.html
H Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 What is a VIP System?Electronics to allow coil splitting/tapping and phase options. That's what the mini switches are on the referenced guitar near the volume and tone knobs.
HANGAR18 Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 HRW pickups aren't made any more and sell for $300.00 (ballpark) used so if you don't like them, you can have them swapped out for something you do like. As for the 535, you can't go wrong and I suppose you might be able to negotiate a lower selling price if you are serious about the guitar.
SouthpawGuy Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Hi Ryantic, and welcome to the HOC. My '07 lefty 535 was bought new from a dealer in Florida, , at exactly the same price as that '97 535 on CL. And that included the upcharge for a lefty guitar, about $300. Also my '96 535 bought used off CL was exactly half that price, I might have got lucky with that one though. Imo around the $1500 mark would be good for a 535 / HRWs. As for VIP sucking tone I don't know about that. I have D-VIP and HRWs on a Heritage solid body with a flat mount Kahler, which is also supposedly a "tone sucker". That guitar doesn't sound too bad at all. Totally different style of guitar though, it's a late '80s VIP2 superstrat. Also bear in mind the Schaller hardware on the '97 535 might not be too your liking. HRWs also are also not everybodys thing, I have them on two guitars but they wouldn't be my first choice for a semi hollow. Check out the for sale section on the HOC, you might find something of interest there.
PunkKitty Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 HRWs are AWESOME! They are the best pickups that I've ever played. And I've played with a lot of different pickups. Welcome to the forum.
HANGAR18 Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Electronics to allow coil splitting/tapping and phase options. That's what the mini switches are on the referenced guitar near the volume and tone knobs. Oh yea, I didn't notice those little switches at first. Or the HRW black dot on the selector switch either.
Ryantic Posted July 19, 2013 Author Posted July 19, 2013 Thanks for all the fast replies everyone. Very helpful. I did try to start a negotiation with the guy a few days ago but he wasn't willing to counter my offer. I assumed we'd go back and forth a few times and get to an agreeable number, but that hasn't happened. I might try one more time with him.
SouthpawGuy Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 I am slightly confused as to what the seller means by had HRW installed, does this mean he has a different type in there that he/she isn't disclosing. The originals come with it, and wouldn't that be the HRW's. Sometimes people are willing to make a video of the instrument, you could ask and really low ball it but I agree that you could get one here for cheaper and with less ambiguity. The 535 on CL pictured has D-VIP installed, the second gen vari phase. D-Vip uses two mini switches as shown. The original Vip used three mini switches, as on the guitar in the Gregor Hilden video posted above. I had my '86 VIP2, guitar, sent back to Heritage about four years ago. It originally had first gen VIP and a pair of Duncan JBs, I had it upgraded to D-VIP and HRWs. It wasn't cheap, about $400 - $500 if I remember correctly. The seller is just trying to recoup his costs. ..
HANGAR18 Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 $1995.00 isn't an unrealistic price, especially if you like the guitar, and another 535 without those options would understandably cost a little less. If it were me, I'd try asking a few extra dollars if I were trying to sell a guitar exactly like that. At two grand, it's still cheaper than a brand new one.
Ryantic Posted July 19, 2013 Author Posted July 19, 2013 I had my '86 VIP2, guitar, sent back to Heritage about four years ago. It originally had first gen VIP and a pair of Duncan JBs, I had it upgraded to D-VIP and HRWs. It wasn't cheap, about $400 - $500 if I remember correctly. The seller is just trying to recoup his costs. .. That's what I was thinking.
SofaPlayer Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Welcome Ryantic! Not sure how HRWs would be in a semi but I love love love them in one of my Golden Eagles (without VIP system). Oh yea, I didn't notice those little switches at first. Or the HRW black dot on the selector switch either. Excellent information! I didn't know the dot on the selector switch was a sign for installed HRWs. Sweet Heritage secrets, I like that!
HANGAR18 Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Excellent information! I didn't know the dot on the selector switch was a sign for installed HRWs. Sweet Heritage secrets, I like that!
big bob Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Also, Jay was less than enthusiastic about the HRW's and the VIP system. He seems to be of the opinion that the VIP system sucks the true tone from the guitar. Sounds like Jay better stay away from psp least he get a big ol bitch slap from Ren.
mars_hall Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Jay may have been referring to the effect the circuit has on the original signal. It is a filter after all and will change what is in the path. My vip-2 circuit uses pots less than the typical 500k, so the full range of pickup content is reduced and shunted to ground. Doesn't bother me much and I will eventually do the mod to 500k pots when I am inclined. If you are a jazz player, this is not a factor since you likely tend to move away from the brighter side anyway.
SouthpawGuy Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Check out the HOC gallery. There are few Heritage guitars with HRWs and VIP where the selector switch is remote from the controls Quite a few 157s with HRWs and VIP have the selector switched moved from the upper bout down to the controls. I remember asking about that some years back .... the answer ..... VIP works better with short runs of wire. * edited for bf moment
Billgelder Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 Jay has always been a purist when it comes to tone. He has never been a fan of any extra electronics. The argument here is the more wires, pots, and switches you have in the guitar the more signal you lose. This is what he is referring to as tone sucking. So it is a matter of what you want, a pure 535 tone or a versatile guitar.
mark555 Posted July 19, 2013 Posted July 19, 2013 I have heard a 535 with HRW's on it, belongs to Bob Mayrick over here in England, it sounded great. As for the VIP stuff, well that is a case of beauty in the eyes and ears of the beholder. I personally see 535's and 555's (I own a 555) as a vintage style guitar and I like mine pretty much standard. I personally would not pay almost $2000 for a used 535, as superb as they are. For that money I would pay the extra and buy new, having it built to my spec's. If you are not so sure about the HRW's and the VIP pack, be assured that a 535 is a premium guitar and you could buy used and put what you want in it. On a personal level, I have never thought tone selectors and all the extra stuff does anything for a semi solid, they come with incredible tone as they are. But best wishes for finding the guitar of choice, rest assured a 535 will surpass anything for the money.
Ryantic Posted July 19, 2013 Author Posted July 19, 2013 Thanks so much for all of the responses everyone, I truly appreciate it.
bolero Posted July 20, 2013 Posted July 20, 2013 I would just wait for a normal 535 to show up, they can be had for around $1500 or so, sometimes even less if you're patient I don't bother with coil tapping etc I am perfectly happy with a pair of good humbuckers!!
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