DetroitBlues Posted February 6, 2014 Posted February 6, 2014 The new band I'm trying out for has a lot of heavier music, much louder, more gain and what not. But I've noticed that when I use my wah (Dunlop GCB95F Classic), the wah is very subtle, if not noticeable, at certain points rocking it back and forth. My guess is the frequency is being countered by another either in the gain of the amp or in the mix with the band. Are there advantages of using other types of wahs like Morely or the use of more mellow Wah pedals? I've thought about switch to a Morely Bad Horsie II or a Vox Joe Satriani Big Bad Wah. I don't need a wah with built in gain as my Dunlop does seem to jump the gain a bit. (not sure if that is a true bypass thing or not). Any suggestions?
Yooper Posted February 6, 2014 Posted February 6, 2014 High gain smothers tone. The wah is all about shaping tone, or EQ. Dial the gain back when using the wah. It can still accommodate some distortion. Hopefully someone can give you better tech advice.
Guest HRB853370 Posted February 6, 2014 Posted February 6, 2014 The new band I'm trying out for has a lot of heavier music, much louder, more gain and what not. But I've noticed that when I use my wah (Dunlop GCB95F Classic), the wah is very subtle, if not noticeable, at certain points rocking it back and forth. My guess is the frequency is being countered by another either in the gain of the amp or in the mix with the band. Are there advantages of using other types of wahs like Morely or the use of more mellow Wah pedals? I've thought about switch to a Morely Bad Horsie II or a Vox Joe Satriani Big Bad Wah. I don't need a wah with built in gain as my Dunlop does seem to jump the gain a bit. (not sure if that is a true bypass thing or not). Any suggestions? Man, I never heard of wah in a blues or country band!!
koula901 Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 Man, I never heard of wah in a blues or country band!! yes, but its used in rock, and it sounds like the band you'll be playing with are hard rock/alternative/classic.
DetroitBlues Posted February 7, 2014 Author Posted February 7, 2014 yes, but its used in rock, and it sounds like the band you'll be playing with are hard rock/alternative/classic. Somewhere there is supposed to be blues... Still trying to figure out where...
koula901 Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 The new band I'm trying out for has a lot of heavier music, much louder, more gain and what not. But I've noticed that when I use my wah (Dunlop GCB95F Classic), the wah is very subtle, if not noticeable, at certain points rocking it back and forth. My guess is the frequency is being countered by another either in the gain of the amp or in the mix with the band. Are there advantages of using other types of wahs like Morely or the use of more mellow Wah pedals? I've thought about switch to a Morely Bad Horsie II or a Vox Joe Satriani Big Bad Wah. I don't need a wah with built in gain as my Dunlop does seem to jump the gain a bit. (not sure if that is a true bypass thing or not). Any suggestions? How pedals perform often have a lot to do with where they are in the signal path. I believe a wah is pretty early on in the chain - before your dirt pedals. Also, often there are adjustments that can be made to the wah, which makes different sounds, inside or underneath the pedal - it sounds like you might need a slightly brighter tone, to come up in the mix.
yoslate Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 High gain smothers tone. The wah is all about shaping tone, or EQ. Dial the gain back when using the wah. It can still accommodate some distortion. This.... Wah Wah pedal's nothing but a tone pot. It does the same thing rolling the tone of the guitar off will do. Roll off the highs, and it will make the guitar recede into everything else going on. Bring them up, and the guitar jumps to the front. Might be good to reacquaint yourself with Hendrix's use of that particular toy. Also a good argument for attenuating band volume. You want everything to work for the tune, not to have to fight its way out of it.
bobmeyrick Posted February 7, 2014 Posted February 7, 2014 How pedals perform often have a lot to do with where they are in the signal path. I believe a wah is pretty early on in the chain - before your dirt pedals. Also, often there are adjustments that can be made to the wah, which makes different sounds, inside or underneath the pedal - it sounds like you might need a slightly brighter tone, to come up in the mix. Gig Rig (makers of fine power supply and switching solutions) have a page on tone tips which includes this tip - "The order of effects in your pedal chain is a big factor in combined effects guitar sound. Does the overdrive go before the chorus? Does the delay go before the flanger? The actual answer is…you can do whatever you like. Experimentation is the key. BUT, we can offer you a good place to start from. If you use this as a general rule, you won't go far wrong. 1st Germanium Fuzz Had to start off with this as germanium fuzz pedals are so incredibly sensitive to what goes into them. So if you have a germanium transistor Fuzz Face or Tone Bender type fuzz pedal, start off with it right at the front of your chain. It may not end up here, but hear it first with just your guitar going straight in. 2nd Envelope Filter and Tone Shaping Effects. These include Auto Wahs and Wah pedals. These effects rely on the dynamics of your guitar tone and should be the first thing you signal sees. 3rd Phasers/Vibes/Flangers This might sound a bit unusual, but try it. Phasers work so great going into gain stages such as OD's or preamps. Flangers can work great at the end of the chain but for that Van Halen type flanger tone, it needs to go right at the front before the OD's 4th Compression Compression can work well with a variety of different pedals, so best to have it close to the front. 5th Overdrives, Distortions and Fuzz's And in that order. If you go from the least amount of drive to the greatest amount of drive you can get some pretty cool combinations. A low gain pedal can be a great solo boost into a higher gain pedal, but the other way around can often spell disaster. There is one major exception to this rule - Germanium Transistor boosters such as Fuzz Faces, Octavias and treble boosters. The nature of the design of these effects means that they don't like to see the buffer from another pedal at the input. They prefer to see the guitar pickup. So if you have one of these type of pedals, best to stick it at the front before any buffers. 6th Modulation Effects These include chorus and tremolos. It can also include flangers, but I personally prefer them right at the front with phasers. The specific order of the modulation effects is probably the least important as you rarely use more than one at a time and if you do is more a sound effect than a toneful combination. 7th Delay effects A good rule of thumb here if you use multiple delay effects is to put your short delay before your long delay. Adding a nice drawn out delay on top of a slap back effect can sound quite cool. 8th and finally Reverb Technically speaking, reverb is actually a delay effect. Very short delays combined to give the effect of being in an enclosed space. Think about what happens when you shout in a hall. That's the delayed sound of your voice bouncing of the walls. Leaving this effect till last works well with many different combinations including clean and dirty sounds. Again find the sounds and combinations that work for you."
DetroitBlues Posted February 7, 2014 Author Posted February 7, 2014 I'm pretty well versed in effects chain... Guitar > Wah > Bad Monkey OD > Chorus > Amp. The wah sound best with the Strat. But with humbuckers on my Les Paul or H140, its not very distinctive.
smokedtires Posted February 9, 2014 Posted February 9, 2014 I've always taken off the bottom of my wahs and adjusted the tone pot gear and gear rack until I liked the sound when sweeped. Might only take a tooth or three in one direction or the other. Give it a try if you've never have, might open up some new possibilities.
Kuz Posted February 9, 2014 Posted February 9, 2014 Man, I never heard of wah in a blues or country band!! Ah, Hendrix.... a lot of blues with a wah. Buddy Guy used some. Clapton with Cream. Robben Ford uses a wah a lot especially on the album "Soul on Ten". SRV used lots of wah..... I could go on and on....
Kuz Posted February 9, 2014 Posted February 9, 2014 The new band I'm trying out for has a lot of heavier music, much louder, more gain and what not. But I've noticed that when I use my wah (Dunlop GCB95F Classic), the wah is very subtle, if not noticeable, at certain points rocking it back and forth. My guess is the frequency is being countered by another either in the gain of the amp or in the mix with the band. Are there advantages of using other types of wahs like Morely or the use of more mellow Wah pedals? I've thought about switch to a Morely Bad Horsie II or a Vox Joe Satriani Big Bad Wah. I don't need a wah with built in gain as my Dunlop does seem to jump the gain a bit. (not sure if that is a true bypass thing or not). Any suggestions? Here's a suggestion.... add for a support group 1-800-low-gain
Kuz Posted February 9, 2014 Posted February 9, 2014 Man, I never heard of wah in a blues or country band!! Video response....
DetroitBlues Posted February 10, 2014 Author Posted February 10, 2014 Ah, Hendrix.... a lot of blues with a wah. Buddy Guy used some. Clapton with Cream. Robben Ford uses a wah a lot especially on the album "Soul on Ten". SRV used lots of wah..... I could go on and on....
Dell18 Posted March 5, 2014 Posted March 5, 2014 Here's a suggestion.... add for a support group 1-800-low-gain I know I should not be doing this but... C'mon man. I love Tchaikovsky. Beethoven. Miles, Brubeck and Guaraldi. Mississippi John Hurt. Diddley. Albert King. Cash. Hank. Santana Zappa Sabbath Lizzy Steely Dan Kinks Tull Bowie Queen Nilsson Airplane Squire Police Talking Heads J Geils Mountain DK Dickies Clash Suicidal Scratch Acid and on and on. I get high gain metal isn't your thing but c'mon my friend. You cannot just totally disrespect them. Trust me. From a technical stand point (I love their songs too) Morbid Angel or Megadeth or Testament's Alex Skolnick or Iron Maiden will just eat guys alive. I'm getting old and enjoy more mellow stuff but dont be the guy that sleeps on heavy stuff. They can be amazing too.
Dell18 Posted March 5, 2014 Posted March 5, 2014 oh. I grew up around black kids. I like Slick Rick, Public Enemy and Geto Boys too. I'm more lenient with that stuff. Run DMC's guitar tone sucked.
davesultra Posted March 5, 2014 Posted March 5, 2014 I seem to remember reading on the insert that came with my 1st wah pedal in the late '80s. I stated something about the effect being mostly suited for single coil pickups and lower gain. That was something that I found that to be true, especially as in those days I was all about high gain and buckers!
DetroitBlues Posted March 5, 2014 Author Posted March 5, 2014 I seem to remember reading on the insert that came with my 1st wah pedal in the late '80s. I stated something about the effect being mostly suited for single coil pickups and lower gain. That was something that I found that to be true, especially as in those days I was all about high gain and buckers! I notice that more with classic style wahs instead of others like the Bad Horsie.
SouthpawGuy Posted March 6, 2014 Posted March 6, 2014 One of my favourite wah users Hi gain + wah but he still sounds musical and melodic
DetroitBlues Posted March 6, 2014 Author Posted March 6, 2014 I'm bidding on a Steve Vai Bad Horsie II contour wah... Hoping it will suite me.
davesultra Posted March 6, 2014 Posted March 6, 2014 I notice that more with classic style wahs instead of others like the Bad Horsie. Never tried one of those. Perhaps I'll check one out.
HANGAR18 Posted March 7, 2014 Posted March 7, 2014 Zakk Wylde (Black Label Society etc.) is all about high gain and he has a signature model Cry Baby wah pedal. He uses the hell out of that pedal. I have a Cry Baby wah that says Jimi Hendrix all over it but I don't know if there is a difference between them or not.
DetroitBlues Posted March 9, 2014 Author Posted March 9, 2014 Zakk Wylde (Black Label Society etc.) is all about high gain and he has a signature model Cry Baby wah pedal. He uses the hell out of that pedal. I have a Cry Baby wah that says Jimi Hendrix all over it but I don't know if there is a difference between them or not. There was a big fuss over the Hendrix wah, it's basically the same as the regular wah but twice the price. Consumers were a bit peeved to say the least.
DetroitBlues Posted March 11, 2014 Author Posted March 11, 2014 Morley Wah is terrible. Kept messing with my Crybaby, I think I have it dialed in. Morley goes back!
SouthpawGuy Posted March 11, 2014 Posted March 11, 2014 Morley Wah is terrible. Kept messing with my Crybaby, I think I have it dialed in. Morley goes back! So you couldn't get it to sound like this then ?
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