DucRyder Posted August 13, 2015 Posted August 13, 2015 I've always wanted a 4 input marshall, but damn they can be loud. It will be something to consider, when I get the room. I've never owned one. Thats why you get the PPI master volume.... between that and/or using overdrive for extra dirt you can get everything from bedroom to arena volume levels (with as much gain as needed) with one amp. Marshall lost their way after the JCM800 in my estimation.
Blunote Posted August 13, 2015 Posted August 13, 2015 Thats why you get the PPI master volume.... between that and/or using overdrive for extra dirt you can get everything from bedroom to arena volume levels (with as much gain as needed) with one amp. Marshall lost their way after the JCM800 in my estimation. How is a PPI master volume different from a 'regular' master volume; for instance, like the MV on my old Blues Jr.?
tulk1 Posted August 13, 2015 Posted August 13, 2015 How is a PPI master volume different from a 'regular' master volume; for instance, like the MV on my old Blues Jr.? I was curious about that, too. Thinking it's PPIMV maybe? It's post phase inverter. PPIMV (Post-Phase-Inverter-Master-Volume) is by far the most transparent MV that can be added to an amplifier, due to it's location in the circuit being after the preamp gain stages and phase inverter. When it is turned to max, it is essentially taken out of the circuit
tbonesullivan Posted August 14, 2015 Author Posted August 14, 2015 A Post Phase Inverter master volume also allows you to get some overdrive out of the phase inverter tubes as well. At least, that is what I heard years ago when people were adding them to carvin amplifiers, which at the time had no overall master volume, just channel volumes.
212Mavguy Posted August 14, 2015 Posted August 14, 2015 @ the OP... $.02... Lose all but your favorite niche filler in the Carvin brand. Free up some $$. They ARE great value/$$ amps. PPIMV is good, but a serial loop in an amp to put (time based at least) effects into is better with a Dumble style tube or SS buffer in it such as Klein-u-lator or C-lator as far as tone and sustain qualities. Yes, it's twwwuuuuue! Keep a representative of the basic amp types in your stable, and ROTATE through them gigging on a regular basis. Great finger and ear training. The amp in my stable that covers the most sonic ground, shockingly surprising actually, is a Marsh Overlord FSX-50 head, around 35 pounds with half power and lift negative feedback mod switches. Goes from country clean and mean to rip your face off hard rock tones, plenty of clean headroom for Jazzboxes, it has a preamp switch dedicated for them, or a Rock setting for normal uses. This is from an amp stable numbering more than a dozen, six to 160 tube watts, a few of which are one off boutique customs. For the quality of parts, function, and especially the amazing tones that come out of it, the price is a steal. The original Dumble # 124 is easily worth over a hundred grand today, it was purchased a good ten or more years ago for 50 grand to reverse engineer...so getting a similar preamp and easier to handle power section than the original 100 watt beast for way less is nice, for less than 1800 bucks is a screaming deal. And if you want the hunnerd watter, it's not a lot more to get that one. When you look at the parts and guts of a new all tube 50-100 watt Marshall or Orange it's hard to figure out whether to laugh or cry at their prices. Marsh takes the beefy, nicely stuffed Ceriatone board assemblies from Malaysia and assemble the Overlord amps by hand in the USA for less money than the mass produced Chinese gutted "Brit"amps can be had for, a lot less green. Does not need PPIMV, it has a phase inverter that is tuned for balance between the sections instead. Also sounds great without using a tube or SS buffer in the serial effects loop. It's a 35-ish pound head, 50 watt clone of an 80's Dumble build, #124. Runs 6l6 or el34, has bias test jacks. I love 50 watt amps, can get some unreal tones out of collected old stock glass. I run Sylvania 6BG6GA's with adapters in mine, very similar to their 7581A in the guts and tones and far less $$ per tube than vintage 6l6's.
DucRyder Posted August 14, 2015 Posted August 14, 2015 Yes, PPI... post phase inverter is my fav. Theres also a pre phase inverter master volume, but as tbonesullivan says below the post phase inverter gets more gain. Also as you quoted it can be rolled out of the circuit if need be for bigger gigs. Its a versatile set up if you like working your volume knob for shades of grind and it also takes pedals well if thats your bag. I was curious about that, too. Thinking it's PPIMV maybe? It's post phase inverter. A Post Phase Inverter master volume also allows you to get some overdrive out of the phase inverter tubes as well. At least, that is what I heard years ago when people were adding them to carvin amplifiers, which at the time had no overall master volume, just channel volumes.
DucRyder Posted August 14, 2015 Posted August 14, 2015 Another thing that just came to mind is using an attenuator like a Komet or DrZ. Airbrake. Some people say they sound too compressed, but theres a work around by setting them to "load" setting the speaker out to 8 ohms if you have a 16 ohm speaker cab and then plugging the Airbrake into one speaker output and your cabinet into the other.
212Mavguy Posted August 19, 2015 Posted August 19, 2015 I have a Weber MASS attenuator, with the speaker motor in it and al the bells and whistles. if the amount of volume reduction is set low, there is less compression and other impacts. Still prefer the C-lator in the serial fx loop. More versatility in the tones with it. Have run the SSS 100w head with both hooked up, that was way fun, wonderful sounding, and exceptionally easy to play through.
tbonesullivan Posted August 19, 2015 Author Posted August 19, 2015 I'll have to look into those marsh amps, once I can actually GET TO my amps. So much crap down there right now, guitars, bills, trombones, etc. It IS a great workout moving them all around though.
212Mavguy Posted August 19, 2015 Posted August 19, 2015 Yep, that Overlord also has an second input jack that goes through a FET boost board inside the amp. So you can get your solid state distortion from built in the amp on the clean channel and add footswitched boost and more dirt from there. There is a little trimmer pot inside the amp on the FET board to adjust how agressive you want it to sound. Easy to nail the 80's hair metal tones like the Marshall Jubilee and other amps with clipping diodes in the preamp, or come up with your own. You can gain up and compress to your grindy heart's content, then put the instrument cable in the normal jack and have a very different amp.
HANGAR18 Posted August 20, 2015 Posted August 20, 2015 Recently I've mostly been playing my Carvin V3m, which does have a great clean and lead channel, but really could use a MODERATE gain channel. The lead channels are clones of one another, and both have quite a bit of compression. Of all the amps you listed I would say that the Carvin V3m might be the closest to a one size fits all. I recently sold my full size 100w V3 and got a V3m (micro) to replace it because I've been going through a physical downsize effort. (Instead of a row of half stacks, I now have amps in every size.) While I haven't yet been able to to get the V3m (with EL84's) to sound as creamy as the V3 with GT EL34M's (Mullard specs) in it. But it is VERY darn close. (Since I like Mullard EL34's, I wound up installing a set of those into my 100w PRS Archon head.) For a while now I've been studying the Mesa Boogie line of amps. Not only have I been listening to countless tone demos online but nearly every sales guy at my local Mesa dealer has personally performed tone demos for me on amps for their various series'. (The Mark series, the Express Plus and the Recto's.) I've been utilizing a "money is no object" approach to amp selection lately and quite frankly, the Carvin V3m is the reason I haven't bought a Mesa yet. The V3/V3m's are as close to a blank canvas that will allow you to paint any tone you want that I've found so far. What I would suggest that you do with your V3m is start fiddling with the different little toggle switches and try rolling back on the guitar volume knob to get that distortion that you are looking for. You can also try to find it in the clean channel by pushing the values quite a bit and don't forget about rolling back on the presence knob either. Oh yea, try some of the Carvin presets too from the manual. My current lineup includes three heads, 100w, 50w, 50w and the 50's are lunch box sized. My cabinets are 4x12, 2x12 & 1x12. By deliberate design, I can connect any head to any cabinet. (Not appearing in this film is the VOX AC15C that I keep in the bedroom on an amp stand or the "Roland Micro Cube GX 3-Watt Black Battery Powered Guitar Amp with FX" that I ordered the other day from Sweetwater which hasn't gotten here yet. The Cube will go in the basement next to my computer desk.)
big bob Posted September 5, 2015 Posted September 5, 2015 This one...http://carramps.com/products/slant-6v
zguitar71 Posted September 6, 2015 Posted September 6, 2015 I have multiple amps for different size clubs and would also like to consolidate to one amp. After thinking about it for months I think haveing one custome made is the only wy to get what I need. For me it is a vol, treble, middle and bass, 40-20-10-5 watt settings, 4-8-16 ohms and the ability to run all the seven and nine pin tubes. The tubes would be the hard part. There would have to be sockets for both but run separately. A three knob reverb would be nice and a cathode biased tremolo is also on the list, foot switchable too. In the end I think the best of all worlds is only available in a customs build.
rwinking Posted September 10, 2015 Posted September 10, 2015 A few years ago, Randall and Egnator made something called the Modular Tone System, which was an amp (Head or combo) from 15w up to a 100w head. The MTS stuff was marketed to metal guys, but I now own a couple of them and they kill. I am 62 and have done everything from play with Grand Ol' Opry folks to James Brown. I still do studio work and I have found that this one amp can do everything from Metal to Jazz, depending on the pre amp you plug into it. I had a pre amp modified into a 1949 GA-40 and I can get the Jim Hall tone. I can then plug in a Tweed Deluxe module and get that sound. It can also do metal stuff as I have a Bogner Extacy and a Mesa Recto pre amp. These are all tube pre amps and not digital modeling. The power section can do 6l6s or EL 34s. So you pick up the pre amps on eBay and there are some guys that modify them Like this: http://www.jadedfaithmods.com/mts-mods.html or another modder in Prague: http://salvationmods.com/index.php?page=modifications here is an example of this amp doing a nice jazz tone: http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=1234714&content=songinfo&songID=12520152 This very same amp can do a twangy fender tone or a total BB King blues tone depending on the module. My amps have two bays and the 100 watters have three. Check them out. I swear by them and I have owned a lot of amps.
tbonesullivan Posted September 10, 2015 Author Posted September 10, 2015 I remember the MTS system! It was quite unique, that's for sure. A tinkerer's dream, and a quick way to the 'perfect amp'. Sadly it didn't take off hugely well, and Randall is back to making "normal" amplifiers. It would be nice to have one, but the problem is always finding the right modules.
rwinking Posted September 10, 2015 Posted September 10, 2015 the stock modules are somewhat easy to find on eBay. The stockers are passable....like the Tweed Bassman, Twin or Vox AC30 sound enough like the real deal. But then I send the modules off to the modders and they are incredible. My Twin module is virtually indistinguishable from my 1970 Twin and as I said, the Gibson GA-50 mod is like having an old amp.
JeffB Posted September 11, 2015 Posted September 11, 2015 Initially I was quite excited about the MTS series. .........too heavy Had an Egnater TM4100, great amp. Good sounds........too heavy.
tbonesullivan Posted September 11, 2015 Author Posted September 11, 2015 The TM4100 does look very useful, especially with the power level controls PER CHANNEL. Reminds me of things you normally see on Mesa Boogie amps. Still, it looks like a beast, and at 100 watts, weight will always be beastly.
Blunote Posted September 11, 2015 Posted September 11, 2015 What about this: BYOC 5f1/5e3/Princeton/Harvard ‘As with all BYOC products, the Tweed Royal features the finest components available: custom wound Classic Tone brand transformers from Magnetic Components; F&T power filter caps; Mallory and Sprague caps throughout the rest of the circuit; carbon comp resistors; lacquered cloth coverd wire; JJ vacuum tubes, and a point-to-point turret lugged circuit board. This kit comes with a finger jointed 13 ply birch cabinet in your choice of Black Tolex or Tweed.’ A lot of versatility in one box.
bobmeyrick Posted September 11, 2015 Posted September 11, 2015 A few years ago, Randall and Egnator made something called the Modular Tone System, which was an amp (Head or combo) from 15w up to a 100w head. The MTS stuff was marketed to metal guys, but I now own a couple of them and they kill. I am 62 and have done everything from play with Grand Ol' Opry folks to James Brown. I still do studio work and I have found that this one amp can do everything from Metal to Jazz, depending on the pre amp you plug into it. I had a pre amp modified into a 1949 GA-40 and I can get the Jim Hall tone. I can then plug in a Tweed Deluxe module and get that sound. It can also do metal stuff as I have a Bogner Extacy and a Mesa Recto pre amp. These are all tube pre amps and not digital modeling. The power section can do 6l6s or EL 34s. So you pick up the pre amps on eBay and there are some guys that modify them Like this: http://www.jadedfaithmods.com/mts-mods.html or another modder in Prague: http://salvationmods.com/index.php?page=modifications here is an example of this amp doing a nice jazz tone: http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=1234714&content=songinfo&songID=12520152 This very same amp can do a twangy fender tone or a total BB King blues tone depending on the module. My amps have two bays and the 100 watters have three. Check them out. I swear by them and I have owned a lot of amps. Sounds like a development of the Seymour Duncan Convertible concept. I have a Convertible 2000 plus a bunch of modules (both originals and home-made using circuit boards I got off eBay). An interesting (if heavy) 1x12 combo, with variable power (5 to 100W from a quartet of EL34 tubes), switchable triode -> pentode. Lots of sounds available by swapping modules.
rwinking Posted September 12, 2015 Posted September 12, 2015 I remember the Seymour Duncan concept but never played one. I don't know what happened to it. Apparently Egnater is coming out with another version called synergy where amp companies like Fender and Marshall will actually make the modules. Kind of like the series 500 Lunchbox for studio gear where Neve, DBX, Grace, etc. all design gear that fits in it. I looked at that Egnater TM4100 and it looks real heavy and you can't swap out the channels. The MTS system has swappable channels and different sizes.....heads or combos
Conneazoo Posted September 12, 2015 Posted September 12, 2015 One amp to do it all? For me it's the Mesa/Boogie Roadster. Yes it's heavy. The GOOD heavy! I also have no problems dialing in any other tone as well. From Jazz, Country, Funk......et al.
JeffB Posted September 12, 2015 Posted September 12, 2015 The randall MTS amps seemed like a great idea and there are people doing mods to the modules but ultimately after using the amps regularly enough I went off them. They werent "all that" for me. A bit sterile and I also had most amps any of the modules were trying to emulate at my disposal so I could make comparisons. The weight was just stupid. Heavier than a Mesa Roadking. The TM4100 was almost an accidental purchase even though it took about 2months to finally get it. It was loaned out to the guy from Chicago, (Keith Howland, I think), when they were over here. It couldnt be sold as new and I grabbed it at below cost. I wouldnt have paid more for it. I only grabbed it because I could sell it the next day with out any fear of taking a dive. It also seemed like it might be a useful amp for the stuff we were playing. The 3rd channel was where it was at for me, the 1st channel was an ok clean, usable, but the 3rd ch was perfect for any old hard rock high gain song. I never fully trusted the amp even after owning it for a couple of years. I expected it to break down. It didnt but I couldnt remove the distrust of it from my mind. The 3rd channel reminded me of a JCM800 crossed with a cranked top boost channel of a Vox AC30 , or something. It was also stupidly heavy and also heavier than the Mesa Roadking which had become my bench mark for a heavy amp. I think Egnater made a mistake out sourcing the line. Lots of bad press. Its a shame. I think he is a clever guy and has a good set of ears or a good sense of tones. I eventually realized I only need a good clean amp and a couple of stomps. In fact, I havnt had an od pedal in front of my amp for over a year I would guess. I seem to only play with a clean amp at home now. Dont know why. Guess I just got sick of hearing gain sounds.
JeffB Posted September 12, 2015 Posted September 12, 2015 One amp to do it all? For me it's the Mesa/Boogie Roadster. Yes it's heavy. The GOOD heavy! I also have no problems dialing in any other tone as well. From Jazz, Country, Funk......et al. Great amp.
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