jaywolfe Posted March 22, 2016 Posted March 22, 2016 I was just looking at some cool 1985 Heritage H140's on Reverb and noticed- > 2 are listed as "first year" or "first run." They are actually not. Although Heritage incorporated in '85, they made about 80+ H140's and a few prototype models in '84 and these have the ser. no. prefix "A". >> One 140 on Reverb has "BGN" stamped into the back of the peghead, and although this is not mentioned in the description posted on Reverb....it really should be because it's significant. >> When Heritage determine a Guitar has a "minor finish flaw" they will sometimes stamp a "2" on the peghead back and reduce the price to a Dealer slightly. Ain't much, but it's less than typical. MANY times I 've received some with a minor finish flaw or 2 or 3 and no "2" stamp. Just received 1 last week. This involves my calling them & requesting a price adjustment, or a return. About 2 of 3 are returned. These are not deemed a "second" but they truly are of course. This can be confusing. >>> BGN stamped on the peghead indicates the guitar was badly flawed, dropped, cracked, messed up or something ugly happened. They use their old Gibson era "BGN" stamp and reduce the price a LOT. You may have noticed some older Gibson's with the BGN stamp. I recall buying a new Gary Moore Sig. model with a gouged back for $425. It was NOT stamped! (1990-ish) I realize many are aware of all this, but some may not. I'm posting this for informational purposes only.
FredZepp Posted March 22, 2016 Posted March 22, 2016 There are stories of employee purchases that were stamped BGN , to allow them to buy at a reduced cost and also no warranty applies to those. Supposedly that happened during Gibson and early Heritage at Kzoo. ( any info on this, Jay? ) In any case my favorite solidbody to play is a 1990 H-150 that is stamped BG ... ( no N ) I joke that it stands for Billy Gibbons ( ZZTop ) in this case. ha.. Love the neck on that one. I agree that a 2 or BGN stamp should be clearly disclosed by a seller.
big bob Posted March 22, 2016 Posted March 22, 2016 Employee builds are not stamped BGN at heritage! They are some of the best that heritage offers, you should know you own one Fred.
FredZepp Posted March 22, 2016 Posted March 22, 2016 Employee builds are not stamped BGN at heritage! They are some of the best that heritage offers, you should know you own one Fred. Yes, I know that not all of them were stamped and maybe none in recent history... but it was supposedly a carryover from Gibson days in the early Heritage days. If I worked there and could buy for a lot less with a BGN stamp, believe me I'd be doing it.... .... Ha, funny to image the Centurion with a BGN stamp... wouldn't do that one.
jaywolfe Posted March 23, 2016 Author Posted March 23, 2016 An important point is that there was & is no set policy and these things can vary. I have bought a number of Employee Guitars without the stamp but I was aware of such a policy. It's just not enforced. BTW- BGN is for "Bargain, which I failed to mention. I recall when Barney Kessel was on his last days and there was a BIG fund raiser event planned in San Diego. Kenny Burrell called me in a panic because they'd planned to get a Guitar from Gibson for him, Barney & the other performers to sign. This signed piece was to be the main auction item. The event was a few days off & Gibson had broken many promises to send them said instrument. Gibson let them down & Kenny was really upset with them. I called Kalamazoo and they had a "white" H157 that was a BGN. I secured it & paid for overnight shipping to Kenny's office at UCLA. The signed Heritage fetched over 4k at auction and Kenny was the hero. Big Thanks to the Heritage gang for saving the day with a BGN, which is perfect for an autograph instrument. The white color was ideal. In the past few decades I have had occasions when a player requested a used Heritage for performing and cosmetics were not important. I would call Kal. and ask them to please "drop something quick & call me back." Don't know if they ever did, but I did ask. Jay Wolfe
yoslate Posted March 24, 2016 Posted March 24, 2016 An important point is that there was & is no set policy and these things can vary. I have bought a number of Employee Guitars without the stamp but I was aware of such a policy. It's just not enforced. BTW- BGN is for "Bargain, which I failed to mention. I recall when Barney Kessel was on his last days and there was a BIG fund raiser event planned in San Diego. Kenny Burrell called me in a panic because they'd planned to get a Guitar from Gibson for him, Barney & the other performers to sign. This signed piece was to be the main auction item. The event was a few days off & Gibson had broken many promises to send them said instrument. Gibson let them down & Kenny was really upset with them. I called Kalamazoo and they had a "white" H157 that was a BGN. I secured it & paid for overnight shipping to Kenny's office at UCLA. The signed Heritage fetched over 4k at auction and Kenny was the hero. Big Thanks to the Heritage gang for saving the day with a BGN, which is perfect for an autograph instrument. The white color was ideal. In the past few decades I have had occasions when a player requested a used Heritage for performing and cosmetics were not important. I would call Kal. and ask them to please "drop something quick & call me back." Don't know if they ever did, but I did ask. Jay Wolfe Really god story, Jay! Really good!
yoslate Posted March 24, 2016 Posted March 24, 2016 Edit: "Really good story, Jay!" Sheesh! Time for new specs, dammitttt!
tulk1 Posted March 24, 2016 Posted March 24, 2016 Edit: "Really good story, Jay!" Sheesh! Time for new specs, dammitttt! .... .... 5 piece maple neck MoP inlays Solid Gold Hardware ThroBak Pickups ... And please drop my guitar first I like it!!
DetroitBlues Posted March 24, 2016 Posted March 24, 2016 Employee builds are not stamped BGN at heritage! They are some of the best that heritage offers, you should know you own one Fred. Is it possible in from 1984 and 1985 they did?
FredZepp Posted March 24, 2016 Posted March 24, 2016 And it must be said that some of the employee builds that we've seen are exceptional. With drastic customizing and unusual features, they can represent some of the future directions that the company may eventually take and features that could be offered. I enjoy seeing these at PSP events. I wouldn't expect some of these exceptional personal instruments to be labeled as a bargain instrument.
DetroitBlues Posted March 25, 2016 Posted March 25, 2016 And it must be said that some of the employee builds that we've seen are exceptional. With drastic customizing and unusual features, they can represent some of the future directions that the company may eventually take and features that could be offered. I enjoy seeing these at PSP events. I wouldn't expect some of these exceptional personal instruments to be labeled as a bargain instrument. Arnie has made some unique guitars for sure. I've seen a few others as well.. Of course the checkerboard bound guitar has never surfaced...
alanjohnlew Posted July 2, 2016 Posted July 2, 2016 My H127 from '86 has a DD neck and is stamped 2 and BGN.
High Flying Bird Posted July 3, 2016 Posted July 3, 2016 Marv Lamb held my "2" H-475 in his hands and couldn't tell me why it was a "2." ;^)
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