New(er) Heritage Neck Angle & Set Height, Preference?

[deytookerjaabs]

I'd swear, maybe it's just me and I'm crazy, but the Heritage's I've owned in the past were built with a more "Historic" (i.e. 50's Gibson) neck angle & set height. I sold a guitar recently and am on the hunt again barring another sale or two, played a couple new H-535's at a shop but they seemed to have a "Standard" (i.e. modern "standard" series Gibby) neck angle & set. So Iooked at some older one's online and maybe I'm not crazy?

 

 

Here's an early 90's H535:

 

 

Not the best angle but notice the fretboard just barely grazes the top and just a tiny bit of heel is visible under the fretboard where it ends.

 

 

Now, on this new model the board & strings seem to sit a good bit higher from the guitar's top. Maybe it's just a taller fretboard with taller binding? Plus, everything seems to follow from the neck angle to the bridge height and even the pickup rings seem taller etc...

 

Anyways, if this is the case, I personally prefer the Historic set/feel 9 times out of 10. Makes the whole area around the heel more petite/ergonomic but I know it's different strokes for different folks. I also dig when the strings sit closer to the guitar's top just like they did in the mid to late 50's. It's one of the things that separated it from the big company, the fact that the dimensions felt more like the crazy expensive "Historic & Custom Shop" line of guitars.

 

Was there an intentional change at some point or am I seeing/feeling things that aren't there. I know for sure there's a good bit of difference in the Gibson Standard 335 neck height/set than, say, the much more shallow/historic '58/'59 reissue.

 

Thoughts?

 

Thanks!

[111518]

Interesting post. I can't really respond to your basic question, because I haven't seen any recent production 535s to judge a change, but, this post did make me aware, in a way I wasn't before, that my ten-year old 535 definitely does have a shallower, and more early 335-like, neck angle than recent Gibson production.

 

I play two semis almost daily, my 535 and a Nashville reissue Riviera that is basically an early 90s 335 with different pickups and slightly different hardware. Thee two guitars --one lives upstairs and one downstairs-- feel (and sound) very different, but I never thought about the contribution of neck angle to that difference, until I read your post and then compared the two directly. The angle on the Rivera is definitely greater, bridge higher, more of a rise of the fingerboard over the body. I've always ascribed the different feel to different neck carves, and in particular to different body depths so they sit differently when I play them, but, perhaps the neck angle is more of a factor than I'd considered.

 

Again, a product of living in the back of beyond and not seeing a lot of quality guitars, but I've always thought of the lack of neck angle on the early 335's as a design flaw, just as on some of the earliest LP's. Back when I was in the guitar biz, I heard a lot about the very earliest 335's being less desirable for this very reason, and I've read about players having to grind away part of the bottom of ABRs to get decent action on those guitars, as a stopgap before the very major surgery of a full neck reset. Certainly with an acoustic having some saddle and bridge height gives a way to compensate as the neck begins to move, so are usually considered desirable. So, I hadn't before thought of strings closer to the body as an advantage, or something Gibson would emulate on its reissues.

 

Maybe someone with a very-recent production 535 and an older one could chime in about the comparison of the two. I presume heritage uses some sort of jig to set neck angles, so, it would be interesting to know if they made an intentional change.

[DetroitBlues]

I think you have to keep in mind these are build by hand. So one 535 built in the 90's may not be built by the same hands in 2016. Each neck is hand fit to the body, so they will vary just as much as the person installing the neck...

[Gitfiddler]

I haven't noticed any obvious changes in the neck angles of H535 or H555 over the years....but that has never crossed my mind either.

 

Maybe one of the HOC Heritage Dealers can chime in since they see and handle hundreds of these instruments over the years.

 

One thing I have noticed is that Heritage tends to look for ways to improve on former Gibson designs, and gradually improve their own products. Some of the latter might have come from dealer input or their own desire to improve QC.

[deytookerjaabs]

Interesting post. I can't really respond to your basic question, because I haven't seen any recent production 535s to judge a change, but, this post did make me aware, in a way I wasn't before, that my ten-year old 535 definitely does have a shallower, and more early 335-like, neck angle than recent Gibson production.

 

I play two semis almost daily, my 535 and a Nashville reissue Riviera that is basically an early 90s 335 with different pickups and slightly different hardware. Thee two guitars --one lives upstairs and one downstairs-- feel (and sound) very different, but I never thought about the contribution of neck angle to that difference, until I read your post and then compared the two directly. The angle on the Rivera is definitely greater, bridge higher, more of a rise of the fingerboard over the body. I've always ascribed the different feel to different neck carves, and in particular to different body depths so they sit differently when I play them, but, perhaps the neck angle is more of a factor than I'd considered.

 

Again, a product of living in the back of beyond and not seeing a lot of quality guitars, but I've always thought of the lack of neck angle on the early 335's as a design flaw, just as on some of the earliest LP's. Back when I was in the guitar biz, I heard a lot about the very earliest 335's being less desirable for this very reason, and I've read about players having to grind away part of the bottom of ABRs to get decent action on those guitars, as a stopgap before the very major surgery of a full neck reset. Certainly with an acoustic having some saddle and bridge height gives a way to compensate as the neck begins to move, so are usually considered desirable. So, I hadn't before thought of strings closer to the body as an advantage, or something Gibson would emulate on its reissues.

 

Maybe someone with a very-recent production 535 and an older one could chime in about the comparison of the two. I presume heritage uses some sort of jig to set neck angles, so, it would be interesting to know if they made an intentional change.

 

 

Thanks for the reply(ies)!!

 

Well, the shallow neck angle "issue" was from the neck set shifting with age, the tiniest shift (which has been happening slowwwwly in on of my 50's hollowbodies) will make the bridge bottom out. But if the joint is really tightly fit and the glue holds they can stay for 6 or 7 decades as we see now. I used to have a Nashville made special edition factory second of a Lennon Casino, when I went to buy pickup covers for the P90's NOTHING would fit because they were all too tall. Took a while before I realized all the other Casino's made don't have the same neck angle so the standard pickup covers are taller.

 

 

Once again, I'm not sure how much is just my eyes playing tricks because it looks like the binding across the fretboard is taller too? Might just be the bright white color appearing bigger than it is.

 

 

I will say, go into a big store and pick up a Memphis Standard then a Historic and the closeness of the strings to the body is the first difference I notice. That's why when I popped into a local shop with a couple 535's I did a double take because I thought they always had that real shallow angle, which I love about'em.

 

I know the necks are hand fit but usually every builder has a standard for the set height and angle because that's not something you want to mess up!!

 

 

 

The other thing about the steeper neck angle with a taller set..is not only are standard Gibby's made with that tall set but so are the scores of imports from the Epi's to Ibanez, Washburn etc... So, it's one of those "separate from the pack" features I love about H535's. Same goes for H150's, which seem to have the same angle as always, the top carve on those and the neck set is perfect!

[FredZepp]

Here, at just past the 10:00 mark in the video, we see a bit about fitting the neck to a Heritage....

 

[TalismanRich]

My 535 has quite a steep angle to it. Its a 2004. The neck joint is rock solid. It may have something to do with the amount of "dish" that the top has. If you watch Arnie set a neck he has a jig that shows him the line. He tweaks each one to get the right angle for that guitar.

 

 

Back in 2012, I took these of Arnie doing a neck on the 535. Notice the shims on either side of the pocket. The second shot has him checking the alignment with their tool.

 

 

[bolero]

I think I have seen some neck angle variety in all the set-neck guitars I have owned

 

Gibson and Heritage included

 

regardless of how old the are...although I have not played many 2013+ Gibsons