Does my Heritage Prospect need a humidifier?

[GrimFossa]

Hey Yall! 

I live in Denver, Colorado, pretty dang dry here. I wanna keep my prospect our in the open on a stand because it's beautiful and you play more if its just right there! Will I need a humidifier because its semi hollow and has the floating block like I would for an acoustic? Any help here would be awesome. Thank you! 

 

Cheers! 

[cobo]

I don’t think a Prospect is going to be as sensitive as an acoustic. That said, I have a whole-house humidifier that keeps the inside of my house around ~40% relative humidity in the winter. That’s enough to prevent guitars and other furniture, not to mention your sinuses and skin, from getting too dry. My humidifier is made by Emerson, which I think is now called Essick Moist Air or something like that. It works really well; much better than the Honeywell unit I mounted on my furnace. The Emerson puts about 5 gallons of water into the atmosphere in my house every day. You can get them at Home Depot.


Colm

[tulk1]

I have a Honeywell hang on the furnace whole house humidifier. Got to admit, it's not all that. I have humidifier "bags" in each of the acoustics. But those require replacement as they dry out. May look into that Essick floor model. They look nice. Agreed on the electrics maybe not needing quite as much humidifying. But my Eastman Octave will drink as much moisture as you can give it. Not sure why it dries out so quickly. 

[davesultra]

I use a humidifier in my music room. Don’t really “need” it as badly with solid or semi-hollows than you do with acoustics. I still use one anyway, and keep the humidity around 40%. 

[y2kc]

Not only do your guitars need a humidifier but you also need one. My small house has three room units running 24/7 during the winter. It is beyond dry here and this makes everyone including the cats more comfortable. Why take the chance with the guitars and nobody wants dry , itchy skin.

my 2 cents

y2kc

[GrimFossa]

Good point. We just got a tiny little humidifier that we keep in our bedroom. Its only a small 1 bdr apt so it should be working somewhat on the whole thing. I might just keep it in its case (when its not being played of course). Want to keep the baby happy!

[Millennium Maestro]

2 hours ago, GrimFossa said:

I might just keep it in its case (when its not being played of course). Want to keep the baby happy!

That's a good plan.  These fine instruments are wood and wood does interesting things in even the best climates and maintaining a correct humidity will not hurt. I have a very regimented maintenance of all my fingerboards too... Involves mineral oil. I too am always concerned especially with the naked wood inside the semi hollow guitars f holes and its vulnerability to climate.

[rwinking]

I live in the mountain west also. I don't know about the Prospect but I was told to be careful with laminate tops and f-hole sponge humidifiers as too much humidity can de-laminate them. Carved tops are fine. I keep all of my solid bodies out in my basement studio and the acoustics in a closet with the little noodle humidifiers in them.

[Heritage1970]

23 hours ago, GrimFossa said:

Hey Yall! 

I live in Denver, Colorado, pretty dang dry here. I wanna keep my prospect our in the open on a stand because it's beautiful and you play more if its just right there! Will I need a humidifier because its semi hollow and has the floating block like I would for an acoustic? Any help here would be awesome. Thank you! 

 

Cheers! 

Semi hollows are fine. I'm running the Oasis humidifier in all my acoustics right now- I always use them and highly recommend them. The acoustic top is thinner than the semi hollow- that being said- it won't hurt anything to use them, but it's not necessary. 

[LittleLeroy]

I'm in Santa Fe, NM, at 7,000 ft above sea level in the High Desert with very, very low humidity.  I've been here 27 years and have never used a humidifier for any of my guitars, electric or acoustic.  I've never had a neck warp or a top crack.  My thinking runs like this:

If I were to keep a humidifier in the case, then when I took the guitar out of the case for a 3 - 4 hour gig what would happen?  Up here the humidity would be sucked out very quickly causing warping or cracking.  Same if I had a humidified studio and I took the guitar out.  But, with no humidity change the guitars find a homeostasis and remain stable.  This has been my experience.

I try to keep my body hydrated - my wife insists I don't drink enough water - but I have not found a need to so the same with my guitars.

 

[TalismanRich]

While acoustics will really show the effects of low humidity (wood cracks and splits can occur),  solid bodies can also show issues.   The first thing you feel is sharp edges of the frets sprouting from the side of the neck.   With the Prospect being a semi hollow, its going to be somewhat sensitive to low humidity.   For my Taylor,  I use one of the little foam filled rubber tubes.   

I also run an Essex humidifier, and with the recent cold weather, its drinking up about 4-5 gallons a day.   I also have a small vaporizer and I'll add that to the mix.   It really helps with the sinuses.   Between the two,  the humidity will stay in the 35-45% range.    That's fine for the guitars.   

When I was in Denver in October, I could really tell how dry it was.   After several days,  my skin was really itching.   

Good luck!

[cobo]

I'm in Santa Fe, NM, at 7,000 ft above sea level in the High Desert with very, very low humidity.  I've been here 27 years and have never used a humidifier for any of my guitars, electric or acoustic.  I've never had a neck warp or a top crack.  My thinking runs like this:
If I were to keep a humidifier in the case, then when I took the guitar out of the case for a 3 - 4 hour gig what would happen?  Up here the humidity would be sucked out very quickly causing warping or cracking.  Same if I had a humidified studio and I took the guitar out.  But, with no humidity change the guitars find a homeostasis and remain stable.  This has been my experience.
I try to keep my body hydrated - my wife insists I don't drink enough water - but I have not found a need to so the same with my guitars.
 

Having lived in Michigan, with its associated wide temperature and humidity swings most of my life, I have noticed a few things:

It seems water vapor (humidity) takes several days or weeks to penetrate (or evacuate) wood, drywall, and other inanimate materials. When I first turn on the furnace in the late fall/winter, I keep an eye on my indoor and outdoor hygrometers. Despite rapidly dropping exterior humidity, and my furnace running a lot and drying out the air inside my house, it takes 2-3 weeks to drop 10-15% relative humidity indoors. It also takes a while to build it back up if I let it get really low. We feel it and react to it in our skin or mucus membranes much more quickly than wood.

Humidity penetrates porous objects like wood. When a piece of wood is saturated with water vapor, its pores fill up and he wood swells to a larger size. Conversely, the wood shrinks when it dries out. The water vapor works it’s way in (or out) at the surface of the wood. So the deepest interior parts of the wood take a long time to change humidity levels. The thinner the wood, the more quickly it will saturate or dry out because there are less pores to hold the water vapor.

Temperature does the same thing as humidity. Combining heat and humidity will really cause the wood to swell. Cooling wood down and drying it out will cause it to contract.

Swelling and contraction cycles are what puts stress on things like glue joints or other sharp corners (like a Florentine cutout). The more often you cycle it, and the larger the change, the more it weakens. Thin tops like an acoustic guitar that have high string tension forces will fail more quickly if they are constantly stressed/flexed back and forth from large humidity and temperature changes.

So it’s the temperature and humidity changes that are the problem. Holding temperature and humidity relatively constant year-round will not stress a guitar. I don’t live in Santa Fe, but I guess it’s never that humid, and the temperature in your house/clubs is probably relatively comfortable/constant year round. So you’re probably not stressing the wood and glue joints very much in Santa Fe. Also, playing in a different environment for just a few hours isn’t going to change the wood very much. Interestingly, people give off water vapor into the air, so a large crowd will make the club air more humid than your house without a humidifier.

By contrast, without climate control, midwestern and northeastern coast homes get very humid and warm in the summer, and very cold and dry in the winter. That cycling over the years will weaken glue joints and it’s good practice to reduce the rate and number of temperature and humidity cycles as best you can. Using an air conditioner in the summer to dehumidify the air and cool it down, and a humidifier + furnace in the winter to keep some water vapor in the wood is a good idea.

BTW, lacquers/coatings slow down that penetration, but they’re not water proof - the water vapor eventually works its way through the thin coatings and into the wood. Hollow-bodies don’t have coatings on the inside and will therefore respond more quickly to humidity changes than solid bodies.


Colm

[GrimFossa]

Thanks everyone who has contributed to this thread!

 

Super interesting to think about a guitar (you think is a dead piece of wood) still breathing in the sense of absorbing moisture. I think my colorado maintains its dryness year round so I guess the stable environment well be good! I have a humidifier set to 40 all the time just about because without it..waking up is pretty scratchy! Super excited.

 

 

[LittleLeroy]

1 hour ago, cobo said:

Having lived in Michigan, with its associated wide temperature and humidity swings most of my life, I have noticed a few things:

It seems water vapor (humidity) takes several days or weeks to penetrate (or evacuate) wood, drywall, and other inanimate materials. When I first turn on the furnace in the late fall/winter, I keep an eye on my indoor and outdoor hygrometers. Despite rapidly dropping exterior humidity, and my furnace running a lot and drying out the air inside my house, it takes 2-3 weeks to drop 10-15% relative humidity indoors. It also takes a while to build it back up if I let it get really low. We feel it and react to it in our skin or mucus membranes much more quickly than wood.

Humidity penetrates porous objects like wood. When a piece of wood is saturated with water vapor, its pores fill up and he wood swells to a larger size. Conversely, the wood shrinks when it dries out. The water vapor works it’s way in (or out) at the surface of the wood. So the deepest interior parts of the wood take a long time to change humidity levels. The thinner the wood, the more quickly it will saturate or dry out because there are less pores to hold the water vapor.

Temperature does the same thing as humidity. Combining heat and humidity will really cause the wood to swell. Cooling wood down and drying it out will cause it to contract.

Swelling and contraction cycles are what puts stress on things like glue joints or other sharp corners (like a Florentine cutout). The more often you cycle it, and the larger the change, the more it weakens. Thin tops like an acoustic guitar that have high string tension forces will fail more quickly if they are constantly stressed/flexed back and forth from large humidity and temperature changes.

So it’s the temperature and humidity changes that are the problem. Holding temperature and humidity relatively constant year-round will not stress a guitar. I don’t live in Santa Fe, but I guess it’s never that humid, and the temperature in your house/clubs is probably relatively comfortable/constant year round. So you’re probably not stressing the wood and glue joints very much in Santa Fe. Also, playing in a different environment for just a few hours isn’t going to change the wood very much. Interestingly, people give off water vapor into the air, so a large crowd will make the club air more humid than your house without a humidifier.

By contrast, without climate control, midwestern and northeastern coast homes get very humid and warm in the summer, and very cold and dry in the winter. That cycling over the years will weaken glue joints and it’s good practice to reduce the rate and number of temperature and humidity cycles as best you can. Using an air conditioner in the summer to dehumidify the air and cool it down, and a humidifier + furnace in the winter to keep some water vapor in the wood is a good idea.

BTW, lacquers/coatings slow down that penetration, but they’re not water proof - the water vapor eventually works its way through the thin coatings and into the wood. Hollow-bodies don’t have coatings on the inside and will therefore respond more quickly to humidity changes than solid bodies.


Colm

Thanks Colm.  Great post!  I certainly have noticed the humidity rise at a crowded gig where folks are dancing and perspiring and drinking.  Even here it becomes like a Turkish bath.

I've also - being the Authorized Fender Servicer in Santa Fe - seen lots of guitars arrive here with straight necks and fat fretboards only to have the necks shift dramatically and the fret ends become dangerous after a week or two.  That's mostly on the very cheap imported stuff, which is probably not dried sufficiently before manufacture, but the fretboard drying out and shrinking also happens to much more expensive stuff.  Santa Fe is virtually a negative humidity!

Granted the longest I've had my Heritage guitars here is about 9 months, but there is no sign of neck issues or fretboard shrinkage on any of them.