H150 Stop Bar

[Conneazoo]

21 minutes ago, TalismanRich said:

I understand it was Factory Direct.   I agree with you on the lame excuse.    If he's not satisfied with the guitar, it should go back.    I just suggested he talk with Pete, as he's pretty much in charge of the shop floor from what I have seen.   If things are going out wrong, he needs to know about it, so it can be corrected.   

This will be an interesting case to see how the factory direct model really works for them.   If they don't stand behind it, that will kill the factory direct deal in short order!

If I was ordering a new Heritage,  I would prefer to go through my local dealer, but would probably opt to drive to K'zoo to pick it up at the factory anyway.   Its not like I've never been there before.

 

 

My comment was not directed towards you Rich.

The good "local" dealers have been effectively smashed.

 

[HANGAR18]

I went and looked at my own three Heritage guitars and the stop bar heights are all over the place. No two alike. One is even WAY high on one side and low on the other. Screw it. Keep it play it. Who cares how f'd up it is. Perhaps we all expect too much from a company which was started by a bunch of retired guys who just wanted to build guitars as a hobby whenever they weren't out hunting.

[Polo]

On 10/5/2018 at 6:40 PM, Jerkey said:

The setup and the email reply was horse crap.. Also I gave Heritage another call today went right to voice mail had to leave another message. No return call as of yet.

 

One thing to consider is that Heritage Guitars may now be running it's customer service dept out of Indonesia which is 11 hours ahead of EST.

This seriously wouldn't surprise me at all.

 

[HANGAR18]

I thought I would show the difference between three of my Heritage guitars with three of my PRS guitars with comparable bridge designs.
What I'm trying to demonstrate is consistency between setups, different guitars built different years.
Heritage hand carves their necks and neck pockets while PRS uses CnC machines for these tasks.

Part 1: Three Heritage bridges.

 

[HANGAR18]

Part 2: Three comparable PRS bridges

 

[deytookerjaabs]

^^^^^^ That's a good example, it looks from the photos like your Heritage bridges are at similar heights and so are the string break angles but the tailpieces look to be at different heights. IMO, if so, that gives credence to Heritage's email that the belly of the carve makes a difference. Also, I'd say your guitars' saddles are slotted to normal spec, slots as deep as 1/2 the string diameter like the OP's guitar ain't normal. 

 

I'd say the reality here is the culture of "outrage" media has crept it's dirty psychological tricks into far too much of our brethren's brain matter. 

Like oh so many things of the guitar world which do not rely on some constitutional set of black/white standards this issue boils down to opinion & experience. One person feeling a modestly tall bridge/tailpiece is tantamount to murder, another looking at his guitar he's loved & used for decades for the first time realizing "hey, my bridge is kinda high, so what." 

I think the line that needs to be drawn is who is Heritage competing with? Because of it's much bigger, older, brother it has certain expectations in the marketplace whether ya like it or not. If they're competing with the Custom Shop one can say that you rarely see an R7,R8,R9 with a bridge & tailpiece set that high. But, for USA Nashville/Memphis guitars this is not a rare thing whether it's 'birds, lesters, standard 335's, etc. 

IMO, at $2500+ a pop for H150's/535's, given the relatively small name and exposure of the company they should be attempting to be on par with certain "custom shop" expectations while giving a better value at the purchase price. If I ran things I'd say it's time to say "**** it" (regardless of my personal opinion) and just move to ABR bridges with traditional posts but do Nashville on request for those who want the expanded intonation deck. Then, keep the bridges under a certain height via balancing the belly of the carve with the neck set angle just like the custom shop does.

It's really a small change and like the extra inch of neck heel going into the pickup cavity it makes a world of difference for those who, as my buddy's pops use to say, "think their **** don't stink!" I'd say the same with keeping the darn guitars under 10lbs, you have more to gain than you have to lose. A heritage set up & appointed like a USA Gibson guitar just doesn't make sense at the prices they're currently charging. 

[brentrocks]

TWO WORDS

 

TOP WRAP

[Jerkey]

Well Heritage returned my phone call and we spoke about the situation. They were very understanding about it. I talked to two different guys a Derek and a Jeremy. Both were nice guys.The vibe I got after talking to Jeremy who was I believe Customer Support was they will be giving me a full refund. I'll post again after I know for sure whats going on.

Mike 

[Steiner]

Well done!

[RhoadsScholar]

Well Done. Glad Heritage came through too.....

[TalismanRich]

Mike,

I'm glad they stood behind the product.  I hope it all works out for you.

I guess the only question I would have is did this sour you on Heritage guitars, the factory direct model, or both?   It sounds like other than the height of the bridge and tailpiece,  you actually liked the way the guitar played and sounded.

[Jerkey]

Factory direct really has nothing to do with my situation. If you purchased the same model from a dealer you would have gotten the same setup as I did. Heritage has told me twice now that that's just the way they are made. The man (Darek) that I talked to yesterday told me that all of the H150 models have the same tailpiece height as mine due to the carve of the top. So a replacement was not an interest to me. 

[HANGAR18]

1 hour ago, Jerkey said:

Factory direct really has nothing to do with my situation. If you purchased the same model from a dealer you would have gotten the same setup as I did. Heritage has told me twice now that that's just the way they are made. The man (Darek) that I talked to yesterday told me that all of the H150 models have the same tailpiece height as mine due to the carve of the top. So a replacement was not an interest to me. 

Have you got anyone near by who can do a proper setup on it?

Just do that and play it.

[kidsmoke]

As others have said, it may well be that this guitar is a combination of a heavy hand carved top and poor set up, which, lets face it, has ALWAYS been a hallmark of Heritage. You may have a perfectly good guitar there, one very much consistent with 225 builds of 70 years ago, not a 'junk' build.

My 2002 came as this one did, from Roman, a dealer with lots of set up experience. In fact, I would speculate mine was worse. Without a scale i can't say for sure.

In my case, all new Faber hardware and Jim Irsay's guitar tech (in other words, a highly skilled tech) has that same geometry functioning beautifully.

It's a shame that the shop set-up/QC operation is not up to snuff yet. It's a shame you were blown off by a CSR with questionable skill level. I think stating it's a paperweight at best, based on photos is overzealous.  

 

 

 

[deytookerjaabs]

16 hours ago, Jerkey said:

Factory direct really has nothing to do with my situation. If you purchased the same model from a dealer you would have gotten the same setup as I did. Heritage has told me twice now that that's just the way they are made. The man (Darek) that I talked to yesterday told me that all of the H150 models have the same tailpiece height as mine due to the carve of the top. So a replacement was not an interest to me. 

 

 

Huh, well through the years I've always seen a lot of variance on the pre-plaza guitars. Another pic of mine from the 00's (formerly), tailpiece decked and bridge height very shallow:

 

 

IMO if they could consistently do it like this with perhaps a hair more dish to the carve that'd be the ticket. 

[Yooper]

No wonder we see so many top wraps. This is typical for Heritage because for some reason, they put the tail piece closer to the bridge. Just a quarter inch further back would have helped ameliorate the problem.

[kidsmoke]

23 minutes ago, Yooper said:

No wonder we see so many top wraps. 

Exactly. Necessity is the mother of inventions. Or workarounds. Or, whatever...

 

[Jerkey]

Well guys Jeremy at Heritage emailed me a FedEx shipping label today. Even though there tail piece design wasn't my cup of tee I will say that the H150 is a beautiful guitar and it played great. The tail piece just didn't set well with my picking hand. And as far as the setup of my guitar it was perfect, string height at 12th fret was right at 5/54 bass side and about the same treble side maybe a little less  and the nut was fine also. So far I'm more than happy with the outcome.

 

Thanks Heritage,

Mike 

[TalismanRich]

I pulled out my 535 today, and the tailpiece is almost where yours is.   This is a guitar that I've had for many years.   There's no way I could deck that one unless I top wrapped it.    On the other hand,  My 157 with the Schaller stuff is only about 1/8" off the deck.

 

Go figure...

 

[buzzy]

Hey, I got it!  This is gonna be brilliant for marketing:  Heritage, the top-wrapper's single-cut.

 

  .  .  .  I have no idea how high mine are and I top-wrap several tail pieces, if I recall correctly.  

Good luck with your next Heritage.

[big bob]

You could order one with either a bigsby or a pigtail and not have a stop tail to worry about!

[bolero]

I prefer top wraps!

I am happy when I find a gtr that wraps nicely

glad it got sorted out....but it doesn't look much different than #2 pic Hangar posted, of one of his?

[Jerkey]

Well Heritage received and singed for the H150 on Friday. As of yet I have not received my refund. It was payed for by paypal invoice so I would assume it would be refunded through paypal so it should be a pretty quick deal.

[rockabilly69]

For the life of me, I can't figure how what goes on behind the bridge messes with your picking hand???  But I'm glad you're happy

with your outcome! You should love everything about your new guitar.

[Jerkey]

Rockabilly we're all different animals. I'm guessing you play your guitar standing up hanging low. I don't play standing up for the most part and if I do, my guitar hangs midway so yes the tailpiece bugs the crap out of me. And still no refund as of yet....