Jazzpunk Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Wow, I post a valid criticism about one aspect of a company whose products I respect and use and people jump all over me. If this is one of those snarky, holier-than-thou message boards, maybe I won't post here anymore. Your entrance was pretty bad bro, no offense. This forum is great and the peeps here are very friendly. I'm sure if you had introduced yourself first, stated what you liked about Heritage and than offered your critique, the response would have been quite different. Stick around, it's a great place!
OldCrow Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Wow, I post a valid criticism about one aspect of a company whose products I respect and use and people jump all over me. If this is one of those snarky, holier-than-thou message boards, maybe I won't post here anymore. It was the incredibly biased tone you used that flipped me. You're a web designer of course you're going to say that an amazing website is necessary for a company to succeed.You said that a poorly designed website would cost business which isn't true in the least, seeing as Heritage is running at almost full capacity. Farther more you imply that a poorly designed website means that a company doesn't care about their product. Where as to me it means they're spending more timing making the product sell itself rather than put all this pomp and circumstance around it and trying to sell flash or using a great website to sell a crappy product, this is not the case at all with Heritage, but you certainly implied that, intentional or not.
bolero Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 the website looks good enough to me...it loads fast, has all the info laid out & has lots of pics of various models honestly all the annoying flash & java plugin crap nowadays on the 'net annoys the hell out of me...I use "noscript" on firefox & it cuts half the garbage out right there
tulk1 Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Wow, I post a valid criticism about one aspect of a company whose products I respect and use and people jump all over me. If this is one of those snarky, holier-than-thou message boards, maybe I won't post here anymore. First post, no introductions, just an out of the blue criticism of Heritage. What did you expect? Not going to post anymore? Okay. See ya.
indravayu Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 First post, no introductions, just an out of the blue criticism of Heritage. What did you expect? Not going to post anymore? Okay. See ya. F. U.
pushover Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 First post, no introductions, just an out of the blue criticism of Heritage. What did you expect? Not going to post anymore? Okay. See ya. Oh.. Man.. Can't believe I've been missing all of the drama over here in this thread.. While I do think that as a 1st posting it was a little on the negative side (putting on my diplomatic hat) it's not necessarily an invalid view. I don't like the Heritage Web site either, and according to the poll neither do most of us. It's certainly nothing I particularly care about, but I do agree it wouldn't reflect on Heritage particularly well if your initial impressions of them are from their web site. But since I can't play their web site, and since I care more about the quality guitars they make I tend to overlook it.. Not that my opinion particularly matters.. My (honest) reaction when reading the various posts, was that the site reaction to the initial post was perhaps a little harsh. Maybe he really was just intending to pick on the one little aspect of the company. Clearly he likes Heritage enough to have found his way here, and while nobody needs to agree with anything he, or even I say, there's no need to chase people off just because you disagree with an opinon. Just my opinon... I could be wrong...
tulk1 Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 F. U. Yeah, now that is what I consider to be a mature response.
brentrocks Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 F. U. This is a friendly group here and we WILL NOT TOLERATE this kind of BS....Admin, i think you can take care of this, please.
yoslate Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 High road, fellas; high road! Kuz, Jazzpunk, Old Crow, pushover and others have done an admirable job of maintaining HOC decorum, and, as a frequent poster, I'd like to thank them for that! From what I've heard, things get out of hand on other sites, with alarming frequency. Bad vibe is exceedingly uncommon here, but it can't be unexpected. There are over forty-thousand posts that have made the HOC it what it is. I'd imagine forty or so of the wrong tenor could change things in a way none of us wants.
Spectrum13 Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Somebody started a similar thread on TGP and the response is quite amusing. The Heritage site is now "almost famous" for it's lack of web "coolness" but outstanding guitars. This might be an accidentally extremely clever marketing approach as any publicity is good publicity.
brentrocks Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Somebody started a similar thread on TGP and the response is quite amusing.The Heritage site is now "almost famous" for it's lack of web "coolness" but outstanding guitars. This might be an accidentally extremely clever marketing approach as any publicity is good publicity. i saw that thread too....the 1st thing somebody on TGP will say..."they need to change that headstock!"
OldCrow Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Somebody started a similar thread on TGP and the response is quite amusing.The Heritage site is now "almost famous" for it's lack of web "coolness" but outstanding guitars. This might be an accidentally extremely clever marketing approach as any publicity is good publicity. Argh you read TGP? I hadn't even thought of it that way, but pretty genius in a round about way.
OldCrow Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 High road, fellas; high road! Kuz, Jazzpunk, Old Crow, pushover and others have done an admirable job of maintaining HOC decorum, and, as a frequent poster, I'd like to thank them for that! From what I've heard, things get out of hand on other sites, with alarming frequency. Bad vibe is exceedingly uncommon here, but it can't be unexpected. There are over forty-thousand posts that have made the HOC it what it is. I'd imagine forty or so of the wrong tenor could change things in a way none of us wants. I thank you, sir.
jerrysleftyguitars Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 Wow, I post a valid criticism about one aspect of a company whose products I respect and use and people jump all over me. If this is one of those snarky, holier-than-thou message boards, maybe I won't post here anymore. Guys, how can you read the word "snarky" and not laugh? Thats just a cool word I hardly ever see anymore. I think maybe I would like being snarky just so I can say "I'm snarky", and laugh!
Thundersteel Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 :police: :police: :police: :police: My (honest) reaction when reading the various posts, was that the site reaction to the initial post was perhaps a little harsh. Maybe he really was just intending to pick on the one little aspect of the company. Clearly he likes Heritage enough to have found his way here, and while nobody needs to agree with anything he, or even I say, there's no need to chase people off just because you disagree with an opinion. I agree. We all for the most part feel the website needs upgrading. It seems as if the OP, as well as others, get turned off by the lack of an updated site. He was just stating an opinion. Granted, a proper introduction first would have been the right thing to do, but we're all different--and there's bound to be disagreements and possibly some hurt feelings. We all do agree on one thing, though--Heritage makes GREAT guitars, and it would be a shame to lose future fans and customers because of a simple misunderstanding. That's my .02 ...
cosmikdebriis Posted February 11, 2009 Author Posted February 11, 2009 Hmm... I got "PM'd" to wake me up on "what I'd started" here. To be honest I'd assumed the the thread had run its course... Anyway, I'm saddened by some of what I read, seems things ran a little out of hand between a few members. IMHO... Each and EVERY member here has the right to their opinion, regardless of what it is or indeed how long they may have been a member here. Indeed this is basic law as set out in Article 19 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights .... First amendment and all that... :wink: Some of the language that has been used has been a little excessive but I'd argue that the underlying validity of the points made were well within the bounds of common decency and should be acceptable on such a forum. Looking back through the thread I feel indravayu was treated a little unfairly by some. Sure this is an emotive subject but resorting to what amounts to personal insults is a little demeaning to ALL involved... Yes... Including the "F U" response. I'd like to think Indy would take time out, "lurk" for a while, and then be welcomed back in to the fold. It would be sad to think his opinion of us at the HOC and possibly even Heritage guitars was swayed in a negative way by what has been said. Luckily this sort of behaviour is quite rare here on the HOC and perhaps this incident will highlight to us all how important it is to keep it as such. It's not the subject matter that is at fault but how we deal with it. At this point I would ask Mr Administrator to pass some sort of judgement on what has happened and perhaps give us a little guidance as to what is acceptable here.
yoslate Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 I'd like to think Indy would take time out, "lurk" for a while, and then be welcomed back in to the fold. I'd like to second that, as an invitation....
JohnCovach Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 In a world full of snazzy web sites, obnoxious Power Point presentations, and other elements of visual razmatazz, I've grown quite weary of such things. I know that a good, up-to-date website makes a difference--no doubt about it--and to resist it makes you a kind of Luddite, pining away for a past that never was. But I have to say, I think almost not at all about the Heritage website. And when I do visit it, I'm strangely charmed to be transported back to 1995 or so. In fact, a big part of the Heritage charm is the company's resistance to the "new-fangled." Don't you find the Gibson and Fender sites a little creepy? Maybe a bit too slick? All that emphasis on lifestyle and branding--the musician in me is turned off by the glitzy appeal to image over substance. I guess I'm just getting old and cranky . . .
tulk1 Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 Well, seems somebody didn't like my response to Indy, besides Mr. Indy himself. As it seems I've been smited. I never really thought much about that before. I now feel as if I've made my mark in life ... or something to that effect. :wink: BTW, I'm the one that PM'd Dave and told him to come look at his thread. I thought he might enjoy the 7 or 8 pages it's grown to. BTW, I actually enjoy all the discourse about the site, albeit I'm in the "ain't nothing we can do about it" camp. On the posts: I still maintain that if a person is going to come out flaming with their first post they are going to have to take some flames back. Dish it, take it, get over it. It's how the world works.
cosmikdebriis Posted February 11, 2009 Author Posted February 11, 2009 As it seems I've been smited. Just for the record... It wasn't me... :angel: Should I ever feel the need to smite (which is highly unlikely) then I would be open about it, as I am if I applaud. As many of you will testify I'm no stranger to controversy but am pig headed enough to fight my battles out in the open without the need for covert sniping. I find the smiting process a little "underhand"... "Publish and be damned" ;D Whilst we're on the subject I noticed Indy had a -7 score. Perhaps in retrospect, looking back through the entire thread, and at what he actually said, some people might find it in their hearts to re instate his score. Give the guy a second chance. Herein ends the sermon from Mr Debriis.... :angel: ;D
Steiner Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 On the posts: I still maintain that if a person is going to come out flaming with their first post they are going to have to take some flames back. Dish it, take it, get over it. It's how the world works. Hurrumph Tulk! +1 to set you even
GroovieGuitarGuus Posted February 14, 2009 Posted February 14, 2009 Dear Heritage friends, I try to explane my opinion once. I hope you will understand my strange English from a dutch guy!... I appreciate all the enthusiasm on this forum. But some behavior and opinions come over to me as 'Colored' by the Enthusiasm for The Heritage. For example. When I was 15 till 18 years old, I was a hardcore fan of Mark Knopfler (Dire Straits). It was like a 'god' for me. Everything he did I (nearly) liked... his sound... his guitars... his black and red country shirt... his hairband ;D. Know (I'm 40 years know) I appreciate that guy, but look with other 'glasses' 8) to him and see a lot of things I don't like. The Heritage guitars are great, but some things can better. Also the Website. We live in 2009... the website looks 1999. We are grown up and MUST be critical in our lives. For every company it are hard times these days. So a good marketing is very important. For the most products, a website is the nr.1 for information. I know a lot of customers buy a The Heritage by spreading the Word... But which company won't like to sell more than know??? If The Heritage continuing building quality? What's wrong with a better website and image (I don't like the advertisements). I would be proud if when the design of the website is gonna be restyled. What will it cost??? 5.000 / 10.000 dollar... if they sell 20 guitars more in a year... no bad investment I think???
cosmikdebriis Posted February 14, 2009 Author Posted February 14, 2009 I try to explane my opinion once. I hope you will understand my strange English from a dutch guy!... Hi... Don't worry about your English. You Dutch guys speak much better English than we do Dutch... It seems from what people say who know the guys at Heritage, that they don't really see the web site as very important. Personally I agree with you and think it is important but on the other hand it's their business and not mine... I do feel a little sorry for the dealers though because they could do with the support. For me one of my favourite guitarists was Dutch... Jan Akkerman.
OldCrow Posted February 15, 2009 Posted February 15, 2009 Dear Heritage friends, I try to explane my opinion once. I hope you will understand my strange English from a dutch guy!... I appreciate all the enthusiasm on this forum. But some behavior and opinions come over to me as 'Colored' by the Enthusiasm for The Heritage. For example. When I was 15 till 18 years old, I was a hardcore fan of Mark Knopfler (Dire Straits). It was like a 'god' for me. Everything he did I (nearly) liked... his sound... his guitars... his black and red country shirt... his hairband ;D. Know (I'm 40 years know) I appreciate that guy, but look with other 'glasses' 8) to him and see a lot of things I don't like. The Heritage guitars are great, but some things can better. Also the Website. We live in 2009... the website looks 1999. We are grown up and MUST be critical in our lives. For every company it are hard times these days. So a good marketing is very important. For the most products, a website is the nr.1 for information. I know a lot of customers buy a The Heritage by spreading the Word... But which company won't like to sell more than know??? If The Heritage continuing building quality? What's wrong with a better website and image (I don't like the advertisements). I would be proud if when the design of the website is gonna be restyled. What will it cost??? 5.000 / 10.000 dollar... if they sell 20 guitars more in a year... no bad investment I think??? I understand what you're saying (as in I see you're point, your written English is better than some of my friends ) but I think the website was originally put up to move instruments. At this point I believe they are selling every guitar they make, so no need to have a web portal in which to sell them, that's my opinion of course. IMO the HOC is a place easy enough to find that anyone can stumble upon if they're looking for info on Heritages. This place is much my dynamic and honest than a website run by the producers. You'll have just about ANY question answered within a matter of hours if not than within a day or two. If anything Heritage needs to push this message board more, with their very few print ads. Which they do, perhaps they see this as a website they don't have to run or worry about. Come to think of it with all this talk on their website, no threads have started about their lack of ads in PRINT which will certainly reach more people than a website would and be more effective in reaching a broader audience.
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