Transition year guitars '16-'17

[TalismanRich]

The best fretwork on any of my guitars was on my Melancon ProArtist T.   Gerard did marvelous work.   The majority of his guitars also had stainless steel frets.  

I once had my Dean acoustic in for fret dressing.   They came back looking like they were leveled with a wood rasp.   I ended up pulling the strings and polishing them myself.    I had my Taylor done by a different shop, and the guitar came back playing like a dream.   

I like the idea of the PLEK, but I'm not sure I would drive 200 miles to get it done.   Closest places would be Nashville, Columbus OH, or Sweetwater in Ft Wayne.

[brentrocks]

On 4/7/2021 at 5:26 PM, GuitarsGuitarsGuitars said:

Your guitars are ridiculous.  Custom Ordered?

Thanks bro.  They were rescue guitars.   Kinda like rescue dogs....but not as cuddly 

[GuitarsGuitarsGuitars]

Did I mention I am a fully qualified Foster Parent??   ... 

[Steiner]

Having spent decades analyzing data from million dollar Coordinate Measuring Machines (CMMs) and Computer Numerical Control (CNC) devices, I understand that PLEK is a combination of the two.  Certainly a cool idea but the ability of a machine to do its thing is heavily dependent on fixturing / how the guitar is held.  Given the variation of neck size and profiles, I will not get any instrument I own within a country mile of one of these things.  Heritage had a PLEK years ago that evolved into a coat rack; with their process of hand-rolling necks, I don't think they were happy with the results.

I went with a friend to pick up his guitar from Ann Arbor guitars,  They did a decent job but when pressed on minor details that weren't addressed, the tech admitted they could fix it but that was more money.  Agreeably, the setup was relatively inexpensive.  Still, I wonder why they'd offer a partial effort.  IF I were to take an instrument there, I'd have to be assured Dave does the work and he knows I want his best.  At that point, I'd put the results against Any PLEK job.  As an aside, Ann Arbor Guitars have some Really Good videos on their website.

The guy I use charges between $150 and $200 for a setup.  When he's finished, the guitar becomes a fine instrument - nearly to the point that you imagine a sound and it magically happens!  He's done it every time for me.  I even ran a Traveler guitar through his shop.  When I first got it, the Traveler wouldn't play the C note on the 5th string along with many additional problems.  I got back a guitar that is fun and entertaining to play.  I pay the luthier's price, bestow him with deserved respect and he does his magic for me.  As always, the devil's in the details; buried in the minute faucets lays a better playing guitar.  I'm convinced that no computer programmer can wash away every potential problem.  I'll take a competent human every time...

[barrymclark]

21 hours ago, Spectrum13 said:

Thanks Barry!   Must check them out after lockdown.  They are a Heritage dealer, who knew.

to visit right now, you have to make an appointment. Safe to assume that this is to control occupancy levels to a bare minimum. May have to wear a mask, too. I'll have one anyway. On the day I drop the guitar off, I don't believe I'll be going inside at all. They'll come out to me and pick up the guitar. I'll report back to you what my entire experience is like: visit, drop-off, pick-up, and quality of their work.

[barrymclark]

2 hours ago, Steiner said:

Having spent decades analyzing data from million dollar Coordinate Measuring Machines (CMMs) and Computer Numerical Control (CNC) devices, I understand that PLEK is a combination of the two.  Certainly a cool idea but the ability of a machine to do its thing is heavily dependent on fixturing / how the guitar is held.  Given the variation of neck size and profiles, I will not get any instrument I own within a country mile of one of these things.  Heritage had a PLEK years ago that evolved into a coat rack; with their process of hand-rolling necks, I don't think they were happy with the results.

I went with a friend to pick up his guitar from Ann Arbor guitars,  They did a decent job but when pressed on minor details that weren't addressed, the tech admitted they could fix it but that was more money.  Agreeably, the setup was relatively inexpensive.  Still, I wonder why they'd offer a partial effort.  IF I were to take an instrument there, I'd have to be assured Dave does the work and he knows I want his best.  At that point, I'd put the results against Any PLEK job.  As an aside, Ann Arbor Guitars have some Really Good videos on their website.

The guy I use charges between $150 and $200 for a setup.  When he's finished, the guitar becomes a fine instrument - nearly to the point that you imagine a sound and it magically happens!  He's done it every time for me.  I even ran a Traveler guitar through his shop.  When I first got it, the Traveler wouldn't play the C note on the 5th string along with many additional problems.  I got back a guitar that is fun and entertaining to play.  I pay the luthier's price, bestow him with deserved respect and he does his magic for me.  As always, the devil's in the details; buried in the minute faucets lays a better playing guitar.  I'm convinced that no computer programmer can wash away every potential problem.  I'll take a competent human every time...

I'm of the mind that this is always the case. The human has to be competent. ...otherwise the tools of your favorite luthier are rendered useless in incompetent hands. The PLEK is no different. In the right hands, it's an amazing tool. In the wrong hands, it's just another poor setup job.

[barrymclark]

On 4/8/2021 at 5:51 PM, Spectrum13 said:

Thanks Barry!   Must check them out after lockdown.  They are a Heritage dealer, who knew.

So, I did the visit today. It wasn't to drop the guitar off but to feel them out. They came highly recommended from people I very much respect that I either know personally or follow professionally. Today's visit did nothing to dissuade me. Honestly, I don't like music stores. This place? I like! These people take guitars very, very seriously. Heritage dealer, too!

I went in and talked to them. They looked over my Tele just to get a feel for where it is now. Played it a little. ...then asked me to play a minute. Asked me what it is I like or don't like. I am playing 8's on my Tele and love it. They picked up on that. In the end, said that it could be tweaked a little but obviously no huge adjustments needed. So, I will be dropping it off on May 8th. They'll put it in the PLEK for a scan and if it could use a little of the process, they'll do it. If not, they'll just adjust the action. Either way, I am more confident leaving it with them now that I have actually talked to them and gotten a feel for where their priorities are beyond the obvious stay in business priority. 

[DetroitBlues]

Talking about fretwork.... My son bought a Squire Contemporary Starcaster (light metallic blue with active pickups).  Guitar looked cool, but its frets were horrible.  Not even my sponge sander trick would help to fix the sharp fretends.  Plus it had some deadspots.

I usually take my guitars to Tim at Music Castle on Woodward, south of 12 mile road.  Tim closed up shop last September, but thankfully, he gave me his cell number and still does work on the side.  Took my son's guitar to his house, had frets leveled and crowned, addressed the nut, and gave it a proper setup all for $70.  What a player it is now.

While I am capable of setup work myself, the skill of an accomplished luthier tech is immeasurable.  Tim's work turns lumps of coal into polished gems.  Can't beat a good setup guy.  Even if its a sub $300 entry level instrument.

[ElNumero]

On 4/4/2021 at 10:37 PM, MartyGrass said:

That is so true.  When I adjust bridge height and the truss rod tension, I often have to put a capo at the first fret to eliminate the nut slotting factor.  I then file the slots down.  The hardest part of doing that is to not take too much off.  Often you do a little, replace and tighten the string, assess, remove the string then take a little more off.  Getting the nut slots cut right for the strings you use does make a big difference.

Some of the wooden bridge saddles are not 12" arcs.  Usually its the middle string slots that need to come down for more even action.

I don't think any of this is bad to have to do.  There is a book called the Zen of Motorcycle Repair.  There an involved true story in that book, but an important difference discussed in the book is that some riders let a mechanic handle the problems and adjustments of the bike while others believe a good rider needs to know how to fix his bike.  There are two types of motorcyclists.  The philosophical difference is important among the characters.  To a degree I believe it's true with guitars.  It's good to be able to do so work on the guitar to make a deeper connection with that instrument.

Maybe that's woo-woo, but it's good woo-woo.

 

send me the book. I always wanted to learn to work on my motorcycles. 

On 4/8/2021 at 10:15 PM, MartyGrass said:

Oddly, in Kalamazoo there's only one place to PLEK, and they aren't doing it for the public.

Ann Arbor Guitars has an excellent reputation.  They do the filing, leveling and polishing by hand.  One of the luthiers there, who's been doing this a long time, said that the PLEK machine requires someone very skilled to run it.  The luthiers at Ann Arbor Guitars believe they can match or exceed what a decent PLEK job gives.  Plus they can do more, like adjust the bridge height and cut the slots.

Elderly Instruments also has skilled luthiers.

I'm not against PLEKing.  In fact I've had great results.  But I've also had great results from Aaron Cowles and Pete Moreno.  The nice thing for those who can make it to Ann Arbor (you already missed the hash bash https://www.mlive.com/news/ann-arbor/2021/03/ann-arbors-50th-hash-bash-will-be-virtual-but-smoke-in-protest-planned.html), they will do the job in four hours by appointment.

http://www.annarborguitars.com/

 

[ElNumero]

On 4/9/2021 at 12:34 PM, Steiner said:

Having spent decades analyzing data from million dollar Coordinate Measuring Machines (CMMs) and Computer Numerical Control (CNC) devices, I understand that PLEK is a combination of the two.  Certainly a cool idea but the ability of a machine to do its thing is heavily dependent on fixturing / how the guitar is held.  Given the variation of neck size and profiles, I will not get any instrument I own within a country mile of one of these things.  Heritage had a PLEK years ago that evolved into a coat rack; with their process of hand-rolling necks, I don't think they were happy with the results.

I went with a friend to pick up his guitar from Ann Arbor guitars,  They did a decent job but when pressed on minor details that weren't addressed, the tech admitted they could fix it but that was more money.  Agreeably, the setup was relatively inexpensive.  Still, I wonder why they'd offer a partial effort.  IF I were to take an instrument there, I'd have to be assured Dave does the work and he knows I want his best.  At that point, I'd put the results against Any PLEK job.  As an aside, Ann Arbor Guitars have some Really Good videos on their website.

The guy I use charges between $150 and $200 for a setup.  When he's finished, the guitar becomes a fine instrument - nearly to the point that you imagine a sound and it magically happens!  He's done it every time for me.  I even ran a Traveler guitar through his shop.  When I first got it, the Traveler wouldn't play the C note on the 5th string along with many additional problems.  I got back a guitar that is fun and entertaining to play.  I pay the luthier's price, bestow him with deserved respect and he does his magic for me.  As always, the devil's in the details; buried in the minute faucets lays a better playing guitar.  I'm convinced that no computer programmer can wash away every potential problem.  I'll take a competent human every time...

"In the year 2525, if man is still alive......"

[ElNumero]

On 4/5/2021 at 9:10 AM, Spectrum13 said:

Barry,

 Can I ask who in Atlanta you feel comfortable with?

Last plex I did required a trip to Nashville / Joe Glaser, 500 mile round trip. 

With as many guitar shops there are in Georgia, you drove to Nashville? Hmmm.................

[Spectrum13]

2 hours ago, ElNumero said:

With as many guitar shops there are in Georgia, you drove to Nashville? Hmmm.................

Have family in Nashville.  Joe Glazer's shop has a stellar reputation.  My trusted luthier passed on so until I have confidence in a local shop, I'd rather not suffer an unsatisfying experience.   

[MartyGrass]

6 hours ago, ElNumero said:

send me the book. I always wanted to learn to work on my motorcycles. 

 

It won't tell you how to fix a bike, just how to live. 

[ElNumero]

On 4/21/2021 at 9:10 PM, MartyGrass said:

It won't tell you how to fix a bike, just how to live. 

I got that part down already!

[barrymclark]

On 4/5/2021 at 9:10 AM, Spectrum13 said:

Barry,

 Can I ask who in Atlanta you feel comfortable with?

Last plex I did required a trip to Nashville / Joe Glaser, 500 mile round trip. 

So, I just got my guitars back. One I had setup with the PLEK service and the other I did not. ...more of a schedule thing rather than an attempt to compare them. .... but anyways.

They were both done by the same tech.

I prefer a modern low action on my solid bodies so they both got that sort of setup.

The Non-PLEK setup I would say was among the best I have ever gotten. ...and I have had some really well done ones. This ranked right up there. Definitely happy with it.

The PLEK service setup... there is definitely a difference. Not a huge one. Not at all. Both are fantastic. If I were into higher actions, I could see the PLEK value dropping as fast the action rises. ...but the lower, then more value. ...to me that is. 

The PLEK'd guitar had a slightly more "butter" feel to it than on the non-PLEK guitar. Slight difference. 

To me, this setup is like that last 1%. You pay several times the normal setup for a slight improvement over the regular setup. Is it worth it? For me? Yes. You? No clue. Personal thing.

I will definitely be taking my guitars there as when they are due for setups for the PLEK service. It doesn't make the tech any better. ...but it gives the tech the most power set of eyes and hands on the planet.

[kartes]

For what it's worth - I just checked the serial number of my H-535.  It was made 3/28/2016 which is just days before the announcement of the ownership change.

[Gitfiddler]

12 minutes ago, kartes said:

For what it's worth - I just checked the serial number of my H-535.  It was made 3/28/2016 which is just days before the announcement of the ownership change.

Beautiful H-535. 

Yours might be one of the last wooden pickguard featured 535's.

[kartes]

1 hour ago, Gitfiddler said:

Beautiful H-535. 

Yours might be one of the last wooden pickguard featured 535's.

Wow thanks - never considered that!  Mine has always played great - a little initial pinging on the G, B and High E strings, but a little lube fixed it right up.

[brentrocks]

On 6/28/2021 at 2:26 PM, kartes said:

For what it's worth - I just checked the serial number of my H-535.  It was made 3/28/2016 which is just days before the announcement of the ownership change.

Evidently the same person filled out our labels.   

[ElNumero]

On 6/28/2021 at 4:12 PM, kartes said:

Wow thanks - never considered that!  Mine has always played great - a little initial pinging on the G, B and High E strings, but a little lube fixed it right up.

What kind of lube do you use for that?  Thanks!

[kartes]

On 6/30/2021 at 9:59 AM, ElNumero said:

What kind of lube do you use for that?  Thanks!

Nothing fancy...I've used a combination of pencil graphite and big bends nut sauce.  Both have worked well.