150CC Parts and pickups

[PunkKitty]

Just a few observations on CC parts:

- There are no markings at all on CC pickups. No sticker. No way to identify them in any way. Just strange.

- Tuners are very low end. I traced the manufacturer based on the trademark stamp under the tuner.

https://global-derjung.com/product-category/jk-economy-series-en/

- Pickup mounting ring screws are hardware store quality. Plain flat heads without chrome or nickel plating. Again, just strange.

- Caps are standard Orange Drop .022 mfd. Seems to me that premium guitars deserve premium parts. I replaced my caps with some Mod PIO .022 caps. 

The wiring is 50's standard and very clean using CTS 500k pots. No complaints there.

None of these are show stoppers. But again, premium guitars deserve premium parts IMO.

[PunkKitty]

It's also strange that they use a locking bridge and not a locking tailpiece when the tailpiece is most likely to slide off and scratch the guitar during maintenance. The bridge is standard Pinnacle. The tailpiece is aluminum and unmarked. Don't know if it's worth upgrading to Tonepros or Faber. Again, premium guitars deserve premium parts.

[kbp810]

The tuner thing is annoying... I'm sure they chose that vendor not because it was cheap, but because they could get the Heritage name on them. I'm sure some people appreciate that detail, but I for one would rather have a higher quality tuner. 

Orange drop isn't really an issue for me; they are lower cost than a PIO, but still a high quality and high performing guitar cap. 

Makes me really curious on the pickups... that is indeed strange.  

[PunkKitty]

The pickups sound good. I have no problem with that. I wish I knew more about the specs. I asked Mike Ortiz about it a while back. He didn't respond. And I agree, I'd rather have a higher quality tuner. I replaced mine with a set of locking Klusons this morning. It's the only brand name I could find with nickel plating that was a direct fit without paying exorbitant prices from Stew Mac. I got them from SportHiTech, so it's a reputable dealer. And yeah, I agree about the Orange Drops, but I'm nitpicking. And I should be with a premium instrument. They are putting these up against a Gibson R9 in quality. The parts should be at least that quality. I feel like they are skimping to save a few bucks.

[DetroitBlues]

In this day in age, I don't think any mid to high end guitar should be sold without locking tuners.  I'm rather amazed that Fender only offers their locking tuners on their most expensive USA models, even though the cost of the locking tuners is about $10 more retail.  

I think Heritage should be offering the same thing on all models.  I don't see locking tuners as a necessity for tuning stability, but as a feature for quick string changes.

 

[Spectrum13]

Old habits diehard.

 

Saving a couple of bucks on hardware per unit times 10,000 pays the salary of one bean counter. 

On the plus side, this gives us who like to personalize and mod bragging rights. 

Agree on the tuners but suppose the marketing objective and cost per unit were considered prior to the order and once received and apparent quality issues were observed trashing the inventory and cost of replacement were nixed for economic reasons.

[davesultra]

I wonder why they even use different tuning machines on the CC line. The Heritage branded machines on my ‘22 H-535 are Heritage branded Grover style. At least to me they share the same dimensions and contours of Grovers.

[DetroitBlues]

Now going back to "economic" tuners...

I've always like Reverend's Pinlock tuners.  Really solid feeling, hold tune well, and it locks the strings as it should.

But those tuners are the same inexpensive tuners you find on Guitar Fetish.  I proved it out once when I broke a pinlock and bought a set of Guitar Fetish tuners just for the pinlock.  Direct replacement.  

Also, I've been using Guitar Fetish three on a plate tuners for my LPJ build from eight years ago, I have not had an issue with the tuners yet; even after I have been constantly changing the tuning from Eb, Standard, and Open G.  Still no issues.

Occasionally, I will find tuners that feel stiff or too floppy.  Often if I either loosen or tighten the button to the tuner (which applies pressure to the nylon washer), I find most tuners work just fine.

[PunkKitty]

Over the pandemic the only locking tuners I could get were the Guyker and Kaish brands from Amazon. They work well and are well made. They have tuners for most footprints. They run  $20-$30/set retail.

[ElChoad]

I haven't been able to figure out why the bridge locks but the tailpiece doesn't. I am probably going to add a TonePros at some point. I will be getting another H-150 Standard coming in soon, so I can order all of it at the same time. It looks like the Grover 406 series mini locking tuners may be a direct replacement. They might be worth a try. 

[yoslate]

Good, legit observations, Monica.  I knew the tuners would go the day the guitar showed up.  Kuz hooked me up with a set of drop-in Gotohs, and two sets of buttons (many thanks, John!).  Problem solved.  The rest of it, no real issues for me there, as I haven't changed a thing because:  The guitar sounds just terrific!  One of these days, maybe, I suspect the '61 PAFs and harness may find their way into the CC.  Still just over the moon with mine!  Spank it every day.

[PunkKitty]

It really is a special guitar. Such a great feeling neck. The difference is subtle between a Standard and a CC. But the CC body is much more resonant. The neck is shaped just slightly different. I'm really glad that I took the plunge.

[yoslate]

2 hours ago, PunkKitty said:

It really is a special guitar. Such a great feeling neck. The difference is subtle between a Standard and a CC. But the CC body is much more resonant. The neck is shaped just slightly different. I'm really glad that I took the plunge.

The neck is a big deal, yes!  I'm not terribly particular about necks, as a rule.  But there's something about the CC necks...they have a feel that's so right.  The dimensions and the carve are a great match.  That's what I like about these guitars, all the pieces were, apparently, carefully thought out in terms of what they'd do in unison.  The guitar just seems so...orchestrated.  Simply picking it up is such a delightful ritual.

[Kuz]

https://www.amazon.com/Gotoh-Large-Schaller-Type-Knob-Tuners/dp/B00EB121KG/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=gotoh+sg381&qid=1672957044&sr=8-2

A direct drop in and problem solved.  What I did....

https://faberusa.com/product/3000-0-faber-tone-lock-inch-gloss-nickel/

Don't use that tonepro crap.  The Faber locking stoptail posts will work with your current alluminium stoptail piece on your CC.   What I did....

[bolero]

Wow Kuz!! Very nice!

[bolero]

 That's bizarre Heritage have no ID on the pups?

 If I ran Heritage, I would have applied for a new patent & put a PAF sticker on there, as a dig to Gibson

[blackholegravity]

I've heard many complaints about the CC H150 tuners, but mine work just fine, although I did need to snug up the mounting screws and nuts when I received the guitar. As far as the bridge goes, if you don't like the pinnacle, the Faber ABRN bridge drops right onto the factory ABR-1 style bridge posts mounted to the body, which I think are 4mm posts (like a Gotoh ABR-1)

[Kuz]

2 hours ago, blackholegravity said:

I've heard many complaints about the CC H150 tuners, but mine work just fine, although I did need to snug up the mounting screws and nuts when I received the guitar. As far as the bridge goes, if you don't like the pinnacle, the Faber ABRN bridge drops right onto the factory ABR-1 style bridge posts mounted to the body, which I think are 4mm posts (like a Gotoh ABR-1)

Actually that is only partly true. 

The ABRN will drop on the factory bridge posts, but the diameter of the posts are NOT 4mm.  You can use the ABRN faber locking bridge but you can ONLY use the locking Pinnacle bridge screws that came with the original bridge.  It will fit the Faber.   My point, don't lose the locking screws that came from the factory on the pinnacle bridge posts because the bridge posts diameters are unique to only the pinnacle bridge, you can't use the Faber locking screws because they won't thread on the factory bridge posts.   

Either way, I used the factory posts and pinnacle locking post screws with the Faber ABRN bridge and it works just fine.

[PunkKitty]

I ordered a set of the Faber locking tailpiece studs. I'm not bothering with the bridge. I'm really fine with the Pinnacle bridge.

[davesultra]

1 hour ago, Kuz said:

Actually that is only partly true. 

The ABRN will drop on the factory bridge posts, but the diameter of the posts are NOT 4mm.  You can use the ABRN faber locking bridge but you can ONLY use the locking Pinnacle bridge screws that came with the original bridge.  It will fit the Faber.   My point, don't lose the locking screws that came from the factory on the pinnacle bridge posts because the bridge posts diameters are unique to only the pinnacle bridge, you can't use the Faber locking screws because they won't thread on the factory bridge posts.   

Either way, I used the factory posts and pinnacle locking post screws with the Faber ABRN bridge and it works just fine.

Jon, are you referring to the “Tone-Lock” series or their standard ABR-59 style? I’m looking to get a Faber bridge for my 22’ H535, and I’m not sure which to get.

 

 

 

[Kuz]

11 hours ago, davesultra said:

Jon, are you referring to the “Tone-Lock” series or their standard ABR-59 style? I’m looking to get a Faber bridge for my 22’ H535, and I’m not sure which to get.

 

 

 

I was referring to the Tone-Lock and the different diameter bridge post threads are unique and proprietary to only the Custom Core's Pinnacle bridge.  The Custom Core has a proprietary unique bridge with a unique bridge post diameter.

The Faber hardware will fit no problem on any other Heritage model.  It is the only the CC that has different/unique diameter bridge posts.   

I converted ALL my Heritages from the Nashville bridges to Tone-Lock Faber bridges and locking stoptail studs.  Here is the link:  https://faberusa.com/product-category/faber-bridges/faber-tone-lock-bridge/gibson-heritage/nashville-heritage/

PM me is you have any questions.

[Kuz]

11 hours ago, PunkKitty said:

I ordered a set of the Faber locking tailpiece studs. I'm not bothering with the bridge. I'm really fine with the Pinnacle bridge.

The pinnacle bridge is fine and a step up from the regular Nashville bridge Heritage uses.  Except it is just as wide as a Nashville bridge and if you like the stoptail piece studs low to the body, the strings will still hit the back of the bridge exiting to the stoptail.  This is why I went with the Tone Lock Faber bridge because it looks like an ABR-1 and has the same dimensions so the strings don't hit the back of the bridge.  Of course if you top-wrap the strings over the stoptail this is not an issue, I just don't like top-wrapping. 

[blackholegravity]

14 hours ago, Kuz said:

Actually that is only partly true. 

The ABRN will drop on the factory bridge posts, but the diameter of the posts are NOT 4mm.  You can use the ABRN faber locking bridge but you can ONLY use the locking Pinnacle bridge screws that came with the original bridge.  It will fit the Faber.   My point, don't lose the locking screws that came from the factory on the pinnacle bridge posts because the bridge posts diameters are unique to only the pinnacle bridge, you can't use the Faber locking screws because they won't thread on the factory bridge posts.   

Either way, I used the factory posts and pinnacle locking post screws with the Faber ABRN bridge and it works just fine.

I wasn't talking about using the Faber locking bridge, I was talking about swapping out the pinnacle locking bridge for a narrower traditional ABR-1 type setup easily, without having to deal with replacing the factory non-traditional spec abr-1 style mounting studs that Heritage uses...not to mention the nashville spacing. You can drop the 59 style (non-locking) Faber ABRN right onto the heritage bridge studs and have more of an R9 setup, and lower the tailpiece if you don't want to top wrap. The pinnacle bridge uses nashville type inserts/posts so I'm not sure where heritage is sourcing their threaded posts, they are .160" diameter, the pinnacle locking caps use a SAE 8-32 thread. Also, according to Heritage they are using a version of the pinnacle bridge that uses zinc saddles, not titanium, like philadelphialuthiertools.com sells, with Faber you have saddle options, but typically get brass saddles. The bridge material is different as well, Faber is mostly zinc, stock is aluminum, so there will be some tonal difference as well.

[Kuz]

6 hours ago, blackholegravity said:

I wasn't talking about using the Faber locking bridge, I was talking about swapping out the pinnacle locking bridge for a narrower traditional ABR-1 type setup easily, without having to deal with replacing the factory non-traditional spec abr-1 style mounting studs that Heritage uses...not to mention the nashville spacing. You can drop the 59 style (non-locking) Faber ABRN right onto the heritage bridge studs and have more of an R9 setup, and lower the tailpiece if you don't want to top wrap. The pinnacle bridge uses nashville type inserts/posts so I'm not sure where heritage is sourcing their threaded posts, they are .160" diameter, the pinnacle locking caps use a SAE 8-32 thread. Also, according to Heritage they are using a version of the pinnacle bridge that uses zinc saddles, not titanium, like philadelphialuthiertools.com sells, with Faber you have saddle options, but typically get brass saddles. The bridge material is different as well, Faber is mostly zinc, stock is aluminum, so there will be some tonal difference as well.

You can use a faber drop in ABR-1, but you will have to use the original factory thumb screws because of the unusual post diameter traditional thumb wheels won't thread on. 

I used the orginal factory bridge posts, thumb wheels, and the bridge post top locking nuts along with the ABRN and it works great. 

[blackholegravity]

Yes, reusing the factory posts and thumb wheels…did you notice a tone difference, the stock bridge seems bright to me, probably because it’s aluminum.