Pedals VS Multi-Effects

[DetroitBlues]

Multi-effects pedals are an ever increasing in technology and sound quality for studio and live use.

I’ve seen several bands whose guitarists run a high end multi-effects processor straight into a PA.

Are stand-alone pedals still your best option or have you moved to the digital processing world?

What are your pros and cons of either option?

[t0aj15]

I've been using Fractals Axe-Fx for more then ten years now. The current model is the Axe-Fx III MkII Turbo. One by one all my amps & all my efx are fading away. I still have a couple amps I'll hold onto like my Rivera Stage IV and my Mesa JP2C+ but for the most part the others have just become door-stops.

[bobmeyrick]

While i still have a lot of individual pedals, I've recently been gigging with a TC Electronics Plethora X5. Basically the Plethora has 5 slots which can contain any of TC's Toneprint-enabled pedals - I think that's about 15 in total. The combinations can be stored as a 'board', and it has space for 127 boards...

My most used board has the following - Viscous Vibe -> Corona Chorus -> Pipeline Tremolo -> Flashback Delay -> Hall of Fame Reverb. There aren't any overdrives, they're all digital fx. TC do make a nice OD, though, the MojoMojo.

Anyway, check out the videos - it's a great bit of kit!

[big bob]

I have lots of great (antique) pedals like a big box EHX memory man, soldano super charger gto, Timmy, ocd, etc. 

 

and with a clean amp, … way better and than any multi effx. Hard stop!

[Yooper]

I hate messing with pedals.

Tweaking, sequence changes, getting and setting up a board, misstepping onto adjacent pedals, accommodating various guitars, etc.

But dang! I sure do like playing with all the sounds. It's what makes electric guitar even more fun. 

[rwinking]

I still have some old analog pedals around but never use them live. I use the TC Plethora X5, A Helix rack/control combo, HX FX and Quad Cortex, depending on my gig. I am not using digital amps (except at one of our rehearsal studios I use the Stomp XL with a Carvin amp pedal into a 1X12 cab) but as I said in another thread, with the QC and the Line 6 power cab, I am about ready to actually gig all digital.

The FX are nearly perfect if you tweak them. The TC and QC have better verbs than line 6. Line 6 and QC have some amazing distorion overdrive models. I have an old 1980s Ibanez UE400(which I guess is one of the OG Multi FX units) that has an old tube screamer built in. With either the QC or L6 and I can tweak it to where I cannot tell the difference. Same with the Chorus. Here's a great video from a few years back that kind of shows the capbility of these multi FX pedals.

 

[gpuma]

When I had a pedalboard it definitely was a love/hate relationship.  It was love at home, hate on stage.

[TalismanRich]

I've got an RP-355 multi effects pedal that I picked up years ago.   They sound like a great idea, but it was just too many options, buttons to press, knobs to twist.   My patience ran short.   And where the hell is the on/off switch??

On the other hand,  stand alone pedals aren't foolproof.   My MDV2 went on the fritz yesterday.   No clue as to why it's dying, but with Fulltone pulling the plug,  getting it fixed could be a problem.   It might be cheaper to just buy a cheap vibe pedal and be done with it!.

 

 

[rockabilly69]

6 hours ago, gpuma said:

When I had a pedalboard it definitely was a love/hate relationship.  It was love at home, hate on stage.

My pedalboard gets smaller and smaller every year for just that reason. Most of my gigs are acoustic guitar based so I have different requirements than most people here, and one of those is more EQ than a typical mixer provides, so I am a slave to that. I also like a volume pedal and tuner, as I go through multiple tunings at a typical gig. 

At home I usually just plug in straight in, or at the most, one or two pedals if I need Delay and/or Trem with my Mesa Fillmore. 

[greywolf66]

I try to keep my pedal board to a minimum . With some of the new multi effects boxes that makes it easy . My Keeley Dark Side and a tuner cover a huge amount of territory with minimal footprint ( Dist/ Phase/ Univibe/ Flange/ Rotary / Delay ) , add a good preamp/DI and it makes packing for a gig a snap. 

[gpuma]

If I ever start gigging again, I will definitely take the multi fx route. I had too many headaches with jumper cables, power, changing 200 settings between songs... not worth it for what I used to do.

[rwinking]

About a third of my gigs are now acoustic and I use the Quad Cortex for that too. You can add acoustic guitar IRs to the signal and it is more and more like having a mic'd guitar without the hassle. All of my acoustics have the Dimarzio BLack Angel system with a magnetic and a piezo. I send this into a Grace Felix and then into the QC. Lately too, I have found that some folks out there in digital land have been capturing API and Neve mic preamps and they come with QC cloud.  I usually run all of this into the Line 6 powercab in FRFR mode. I add  some nice verbs or delays in the QC (the FX are stunning.) I have been chasing acoustic tone for years and I am now happier than I have ever been.

Don't get me wrong....I still love my tubes. But......

[Kuz]

100%, no doubt, not even close for PEDALS.   They sound better, easier to dial in, and during a gig you just reach down and adjust the knobs on the pedals... no scrolling through menus to adjust parameters live.  With the midi switching systems like the GigRid G3 or G2 and Boss Es800, those systems make your analog pedals perform like an all in one effects unit, but you are using your analog pedals.

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/ES8--boss-es-8-effects-switching-system

https://shopusa.thegigrig.com/G3

[t0aj15]

Visiting this site is like a trip back to the Jurassic age.  ?

[kbp810]

11 hours ago, t0aj15 said:

Visiting this site is like a trip back to the Jurassic age.  ?

Hey, get off my lawn you whippersnapper! ?

I'm generally a no-pedal guitar straight into amp kind of person (I know, I'm no fun at parties either!)... but... just for the hell of it, I very recently trialed a Neural DSP plugin (Gojira), and I'll likely be coughing up the cash to retain it once the trial is expired. Still not even close to a replacement for the real thing for me, but for simplicity of plugging into a DAW, using a good pair of headphones, and jamming at my desk while I'm probably supposed to be working; it sounds pretty damn good and lots of fun to play around with. 

It's the closest I've come yet to adapting to the modern guitar world, so maybe there's hope for me yet. Now if anyone needs me, going to go cleanse the tonal pallet with a cranked 5E3 like the brachiosaurus I am ?

[rwinking]

On 4/11/2023 at 5:05 AM, Kuz said:

They sound better, easier to dial in, and during a gig you just reach down and adjust the knobs on the pedals...

Not sure about that statement. How can a digital delay or reverb pedal sound better than the same delay or verb in a multi FX unit (i.e Plethora X5)?

My Helix is in a rack, so it is much easier to turn around and tweak an effect than to bend over and tweak a pedal board. Also, all FX can be tweaked via xpression pedal.

Maybe an analog OD/Distortion pedal sounds better that a digital but I have tried the experiment from the video above where I compare an Ibanez OD to it's digital counterpart and I honestly can't tell the difference if I spend some time with it. Once I get it right, no more tweaking as I can save the parameters as defaults. Now remember, I am an old guy who grew up in the analog world and fought this shit tooth and nail. It became time to surrender to it.

The major drawback that I see is having 30 distortion/fuzz pedals at my disposal (or reverbs, chorus/trems, etc) but I usually find a few that are perfect for me and stick with them, at least live. In my studio work, I can experiemnt a little more.

[gpuma]

At the end of the day, the difference in sound is subjective but unless your setup is extremely simple with one or two pedals, a multi fx has the advantage of removing jumpers cable (and related issues) and power cables (and related issues). This alone makes it a very attractive option IMHO.

But, at the same time it is undeniable that a modern multi fx requires a steeper learning curve just because of the sheer amount of options offered.  Nonetheless once learned, you tipically recall a song setting with a lot fewer steps that those required on a pedal board, usually without even having to bend down.

Finally, I think it all depends on the context: studio, stage or home have very different requirements.

[Kuz]

17 hours ago, rwinking said:

Not sure about that statement. How can a digital delay or reverb pedal sound better than the same delay or verb in a multi FX unit (i.e Plethora X5)?

My Helix is in a rack, so it is much easier to turn around and tweak an effect than to bend over and tweak a pedal board. Also, all FX can be tweaked via xpression pedal.

Maybe an analog OD/Distortion pedal sounds better that a digital but I have tried the experiment from the video above where I compare an Ibanez OD to it's digital counterpart and I honestly can't tell the difference if I spend some time with it. Once I get it right, no more tweaking as I can save the parameters as defaults. Now remember, I am an old guy who grew up in the analog world and fought this shit tooth and nail. It became time to surrender to it.

The major drawback that I see is having 30 distortion/fuzz pedals at my disposal (or reverbs, chorus/trems, etc) but I usually find a few that are perfect for me and stick with them, at least live. In my studio work, I can experiemnt a little more.

Are you familiar with modern midi analog pedal loopers? 

First, all tweaking can be done live by just adjusting the physical knobs on your pedals (no menus, no parameters to sift through to find the effect you want to adjust).  Secondly, you aren't forced to tweak or accept the tones the multi-effects offers.  If you don't like the effect or OD/Dist effect, just use your physical pedals you love.  Third, you can rearrange your pedals in any order in the path without physically moving them (put your Tremolo before or after your delay by just touching a button).   Forth, what can you do if you are playing live and the effect unit's preset needs more OD or more compression? I just step on the patch to my compressor or OD and it's on.  If it's too loud, I reach down and turn it down.  On the fly editing.  Fifth, my pedals are ALWAYS on so I can tone stack several OD pedals for a HUGE tone and save that preset with one touch of a button.  If it's a bit too much, edit by I just stomping on the patch to the OD I want to turn off and it's out of the chain.

I have owned many effects units from rack stuff to Axe-Fx to Line 6 stuff.  I like to use them with home recordings because if you save a preset no worry if the mic is now in a different position for overdubs.  Just pull up that preset and it's the same I used before.  But I still run my pedals through the amp & cabinet simulators.

I am not saying new multi effects units sound bad, I just find them not practical for live applications and will always be more limiting in their effects offers compared to my pedal collection. 

[Kuz]

8 hours ago, gpuma said:

At the end of the day, the difference in sound is subjective but unless your setup is extremely simple with one or two pedals, a multi fx has the advantage of removing jumpers cable (and related issues) and power cables (and related issues). This alone makes it a very attractive option IMHO.

But, at the same time it is undeniable that a modern multi fx requires a steeper learning curve just because of the sheer amount of options offered.  Nonetheless once learned, you tipically recall a song setting with a lot fewer steps that those required on a pedal board, usually without even having to bend down.

Finally, I think it all depends on the context: studio, stage or home have very different requirements.

I disagree.  With new modern midi-looper all the pedals are on.  SO I can assign a patch with all the effects I want on and switch to a different patch by pressing one button.

The bottom line is new modern midi pedal loopers have all the programing ability of effects units but are easier to save presets and you can edit the preset by just physically turning the knobs on the pedals... or just set on the button assigned to the pedal and the effect is off.  No effects unit can do that without sifting through menus for each effect.

Again, to each their own.  It's great we have the flexibility to chose what is more practical to use individually. 

[davesultra]

I’ve never really gotten into pedals (at least beyond a Wah). I do have some pedals lying around, but never really use them. Last year I picked up a BOSS multi-effect “dealy”, but again I never have really gotten into it. I’ve always just preferred the basic “guitar/cable/amp” approach. But then again I’ve never claimed to be even a mediocre player.

[gpuma]

1 hour ago, Kuz said:

I disagree.  With new modern midi-looper all the pedals are on.  SO I can assign a patch with all the effects I want on and switch to a different patch by pressing one button.

The bottom line is new modern midi pedal loopers have all the programing ability of effects units but are easier to save presets and you can edit the preset by just physically turning the knobs on the pedals... or just set on the button assigned to the pedal and the effect is off.  No effects unit can do that without sifting through menus for each effect.

Again, to each their own.  It's great we have the flexibility to chose what is more practical to use individually. 

I may be ignorant here but isn't the patch on a midi-looper only saving the signal flow and not the individual effect settings? if you have an analog delay on the board, you are not able to change its settings, while at the same time change the settings on your compressor, EQ and whatever else you have on the board without changing the individual knobs on the pedals.  

[DetroitBlues]

I’m getting a lot of good info here along with some interesting debates.

The two biggest problems I’ve been having is single effects turning on/off sometimes leads to adjusting the controls inadvertently.  The other piece is the moving of the boards from one place to another almost always knocks off my settings; this means wasting time setting up to tweak. So I thought about mid-level multi-effects whose settings are stored and just plug in and go.

But I like my drives and my wah.  The modulated effects are what I thought about replacing, but really can’t find something that is just that.  I don’t need amp/cab simulators, drives, and other effects…

[bobmeyrick]

6 hours ago, DetroitBlues said:

The modulated effects are what I thought about replacing, but really can’t find something that is just that.

That's pretty much what the Plethora X5 does - it can contain all of TC's Toneprint pedals, which are largely chorus, phaser, flanger, vibrato, tremolo, pitch change etc. There are no ovedrives or distortions. If you don't need five effects they now have the Plethora X3, which as the name implies, has three slots for Toneprint effects.

[rwinking]

I use the X5 on one of my rigs and the modulated FX are great. The cool thing is if I want to put a real tube Screamer in the FX chain it is ultra simple. Just plug it in. I could not beat the price. For the price of a reverb and delay pedal, I got all of those TC Toneprints in one package...... dozens of verbs, delays, trems, flangers, even compressers. Plus it has all of those different banks and FX chains with the press of a button. If you can't find a usable sound in there, you haven't really looked. It took me a while to realize that as a cork sniffer I had not really given these things a chance. Mostly I think I was scared to have to learn how to use them. A lot of us old guys are like that....."I'll never use anything but pedals!" can translate to "I'm too old to change." Both are great. One just has more options.

[Kuz]

On 4/13/2023 at 9:42 AM, gpuma said:

I may be ignorant here but isn't the patch on a midi-looper only saving the signal flow and not the individual effect settings? if you have an analog delay on the board, you are not able to change its settings, while at the same time change the settings on your compressor, EQ and whatever else you have on the board without changing the individual knobs on the pedals.  

That is true your pedals are at the same values... UNLESS they are midi controlled pedals where you can save different values of those pedals on a different patch.

1) Say you have a BIG delay on your Strymon Timeline with maybe two different OD pedals for a solo.  Program a different patch for the Delay to switch to less intensity & repeats, stop one of the OD pedals from entering the path (it is still on, just not in the signal chain for this patch) for less crunch on the verses.  Then program a different patch with the Strymon Delay changed to a univibe, allow the compressor to enter the signal chain after the univibe effect, and allow the Strmon Modulus to enter the path with Chorus. 

So I am able to program any effect or parameter on the Stymon Timeline or Modulus to change in any patch instantly with midi.  But I can also set the patch to switch those parameters but remain muted until I step them on to enter the chain.  

2) I can also program my Gigrig G3 so when I step on whatever OD pedal, the Compress turns off but the Modulus Flanger turns on.

3) FINALLY, I can program patches so, YES, the G3 will lower or raise the volume of whatever pedal I want.  Solo coming up, step on the "solo patch" I made and the Rat pedal enters the signal and increases 5db from it's original volume (or whatever db increase or decrease you want).

With all my analog pedals that I know they sound incredible (because I bought them separately).  No compromising on, "the modulation effects are good but the OD/distortion effects suck".  If I want to add or remove an pedals from the board, I can.  

4) I can have up to 12 pedals on my board, programmed to be in any order in the chain, and with one step I can change what's "on", what's "off", individual or all pedals volume up or down, and if they are midi pedals change them to completely different effects.  If I can't get it done with that flexibility... It's time to ride the bike instead.