Heritage Custom Shop 225 Classic Humbuckers in new H-150

[lwilliams]

I am not totally in love with the 225 Classic pickups in my new CC 150.

The bridge pickup is really wonderful.  The neck pickup is super bassy.  It does not matter if it is into a clean or dirty amp.    I tried through me Matchless, Fender, Tone King, Bad Cat, Marshall and Helix.  Same results.

In the middle position, it blends ok with the bridge pickup if I roll the neck back to about 8 on Vol.

These pickups are totally new to me.  Have any of you got any experience with these and any suggestions?

 

[PunkKitty]

I swapped mine for a set of Wolfetone Dr. Vintage pickups. I really like them. And Wolfe has a 25% off sale. My turnaround time was about a week.

[WorstBandName]

I think the 225s are a weak spot in these guitars.  They aren't a bad sounded set exactly, but really different sounding than other high-quality PAF-influenced sets out there  Wolfetone is a great suggestion.  I recall he's real responsive if you have questions about what you want.  A cheaper alternative is a used set of SD Antiquities as well.  From there, you have a range from Bare Knuckle to more true-to-vintage spec stuff like Throbak, Wizz, Doyle's Coils, etc.

[rockabilly69]

2 hours ago, WorstBandName said:

I think the 225s are a weak spot in these guitars.  They aren't a bad sounded set exactly, but really different sounding than other high-quality PAF-influenced sets out there  Wolfetone is a great suggestion.  I recall he's real responsive if you have questions about what you want.  A cheaper alternative is a used set of SD Antiquities as well.  From there, you have a range from Bare Knuckle to more true-to-vintage spec stuff like Throbak, Wizz, Doyle's Coils, etc.

For straight PAF tone I like his Legends the best. In one of my Zemaitis guitars, I put a Legend in the neck and his hot Fenris in the bridge, and I love the tone. It blends great with the Legend in the neck. His hotter pickups aren't overly middy like so many others are....

 

[PunkKitty]

I might try swapping the magnets to A4 or A2 to see if they sound better. 

[PunkKitty]

I did some testing and analysis. For the 225 pickups, I swapped the magnets to Alnico 2. Unexpectedly, it increased the output from 7.7k to 7.95k. Then I got the meter out for some other pickups to do some comparisons. Take a look at the chart below. 

I like the bridge pickup with Alnico 2. The neck pickup is still too bassy sounding.  I'm going to try putting Alnico 5 in the neck to see if that evens things out a bit. But that's a test for tomorrow.

[bolero]

Hey that's interesting, thx for posting.

Funny the 57 classic & 225's are the only pups with Neck & Bridge @equal readings

[DetroitBlues]

So you're modifying the CC pickups?  

[PunkKitty]

I'm testing magnets in them. So, yes. If I decide to resell them, I will put the original A3 magnets in them. 

[davesultra]

12 hours ago, PunkKitty said:

I did some testing and analysis. For the 225 pickups, I swapped the magnets to Alnico 2. Unexpectedly, it increased the output from 7.7k to 7.95k. Then I got the meter out for some other pickups to do some comparisons. Take a look at the chart below. 

I like the bridge pickup with Alnico 2. The neck pickup is still too bassy sounding.  I'm going to try putting Alnico 5 in the neck to see if that evens things out a bit. But that's a test for tomorrow.

Yeah, it’s normal for the resistance ratings to change with magnet swaps. Has something to do with magnetic strength. 

[TalismanRich]

While resistance will change when a magnetic field is introduced, I'm surprised that it would make that much differences, since A2 and A3 are very similar in strength, with the A3 actually being slightly weaker than A2.    Based on that, adding an A5 should make a big difference, since A5 is even stronger than A2.

[PunkKitty]

Agreed. Only one way to find out. And then the question becomes "can the output be balanced".

[davesultra]

2 hours ago, TalismanRich said:

While resistance will change when a magnetic field is introduced, I'm surprised that it would make that much differences, since A2 and A3 are very similar in strength, with the A3 actually being slightly weaker than A2.    Based on that, adding an A5 should make a big difference, since A5 is even stronger than A2.

It also depends where you source the magnets from. Many of the low cost magnets have very inconsistent charges.

[TalismanRich]

But the chemical composition of the different alloys is the big factor as to the potential charge.   The various grades are set as to the amount of nickel, aluminum, cobalt and copper added to the iron.   

In the old days, our hobby shop had a really nice strong magnetizer.    Just the thing to top up the slot car motors and gain that extra advantage.

[PunkKitty]

BTW... as you can tell, I have way too many sets of pickups at home. Please contact me if you are interested in a set. I'm sure we can reach a deal.

[PunkKitty]

I put a long roughcut A5 magnet in the neck pickup. HOLY CRAP!!! What a difference! It totally opened that pickup up to where it sounds great! Now it has nice cleans that aren't super bassy. The resistance is still approximately 7.9. The neck pickup sounds good. They blend well. The bridge pickup gets some really nice highs. I think I found the solution for these pickups. A2 bridge, A5 neck. Does that make the middle position A7? ? So these pickups are staying. I'll put the Wolfetone Dr. Vintage set in something else.

[PunkKitty]

After playing around with this combination for a few days, I swapped the magnets to long polished A4. I didn't have an unpolished set. In terms of sound, A4 is someplace between A2 and A5. Some of the boominess of the neck pickup is back. It isn't bad if I turn up the treble on the amp, so maybe that's where I need to focus. These pickups are very difficult to tune in. They are very height sensitive. I went with A4 because I couldn't get a good volume balance with A5 and A2. A2 in the bridge could sound kind of shrill. That's not something I'd normally say about A2. A5 in the neck sounded good, but I was concerned that if I went with A5 for both pickups, the bridge pickup would be even more shrill. I'm not hearing the shrillness with A4. But the high end is quite nice with the bridge pickup.

[rockabilly69]

4 minutes ago, PunkKitty said:

After playing around with this combination for a few days, I swapped the magnets to long polished A4. I didn't have an unpolished set. In terms of sound, A4 is someplace between A2 and A5. Some of the boominess of the neck pickup is back. It isn't bad if I turn up the treble on the amp, so maybe that's where I need to focus. These pickups are very difficult to tune in. They are very height sensitive. I went with A4 because I couldn't get a good volume balance with A5 and A2. A2 in the bridge could sound kind of shrill. That's not something I'd normally say about A2. A5 in the neck sounded good, but I was concerned that if I went with A5 for both pickups, the bridge pickup would be even more shrill. I'm not hearing the shrillness with A4. But the high end is quite nice with the bridge pickup.

I always set my amps for optimum neck pickup tone, and on my guitars, I always start with the bridge pickup on about 6 on the tone knob to compensate for the way I set the amp for the neck. Seems to work pretty good for most guitars. I find good neck pickup tone is much harder to get than a good bridge pickup tone. I like clarity at the neck but not at the expense of the warmth. I like A4 and A3 magnets. 

[Kuz]

7 hours ago, rockabilly69 said:

I always set my amps for optimum neck pickup tone, and on my guitars, I always start with the bridge pickup on about 6 on the tone knob to compensate for the way I set the amp for the neck. Seems to work pretty good for most guitars. I find good neck pickup tone is much harder to get than a good bridge pickup tone. I like clarity at the neck but not at the expense of the warmth. I like A4 and A3 magnets. 

I do almost the same as Daniel.  On the Neck;  volume knob is at 8.5-9 and the tone knob is at 10.  On the Bridge; volume is 10 and tone is 6-6.5.   I find this combination offers the best middle position and then just flip to the bridge pup for leads.

As for as magnets, I LOVE vintage output A2s.  I find A3s just too flat & anemic and A5s too strongly mid to bass focused.  A4s sound very P90-ish to me.  

Like stated above, it is where the magnets are made and where you obtain them that really matters.  Overseas magnets tend to be too highly charged and strident.

[PunkKitty]

I just did a contrast and compare with the 225 pickups (with A4), Wolfetone Marshallheads (A2) in my other 150, and the JS Moore humbucker set (A5) in my Gibson LP Standard. The 225's sound good with the A4 magnets. But they honestly don't compare to the Wolfetones or the Moores. The 225's just sound flat in comparison. It's like they have no spark at all.

Does anyone want to buy a set of 225's? I'll put the original A3 magnets back in.

[TalismanRich]

PK, you should have done some recordings of these changes.   It's one thing to try to describe it, it's quite another to be able to hear it. 

[DetroitBlues]

On 7/23/2023 at 11:38 PM, PunkKitty said:

After playing around with this combination for a few days, I swapped the magnets to long polished A4. I didn't have an unpolished set. In terms of sound, A4 is someplace between A2 and A5. Some of the boominess of the neck pickup is back. It isn't bad if I turn up the treble on the amp, so maybe that's where I need to focus. These pickups are very difficult to tune in. They are very height sensitive. I went with A4 because I couldn't get a good volume balance with A5 and A2. A2 in the bridge could sound kind of shrill. That's not something I'd normally say about A2. A5 in the neck sounded good, but I was concerned that if I went with A5 for both pickups, the bridge pickup would be even more shrill. I'm not hearing the shrillness with A4. But the high end is quite nice with the bridge pickup.

So put an A4 in the Bridge.

[HANGAR18]

On 7/14/2023 at 10:28 PM, lwilliams said:

I am not totally in love with the 225 Classic pickups in my new CC 150.

The bridge pickup is really wonderful.  The neck pickup is super bassy.  It does not matter if it is into a clean or dirty amp.    I tried through me Matchless, Fender, Tone King, Bad Cat, Marshall and Helix.  Same results.

In the middle position, it blends ok with the bridge pickup if I roll the neck back to about 8 on Vol.

These pickups are totally new to me.  Have any of you got any experience with these and any suggestions?

 

 I like mine.

 

[bolero]

Yeah audio clips would be useful. And a good way to baseline changes, since our hearing is so subjective.

Jimmy Page even talked about air humidity affecting sound, which makes sense when you think about it. So listening on different days could be subjective not only from things like earwax levels & physiology, but environmental factors too.

[Gitfiddler]

The stock Heritage pickups sound pretty darned good on their "In Good Company" demo videos. 

https://heritageguitars.com/pages/in-good-company