What Would It Take For Buddy Guy To Play A Heritage?

blueox · September 23, 2009

Most of us who buy a Heritage guitar do so because of their playability, sound, looks, and overall quality. Because the bulk of the "guitar stars" aren't playing a Heritage, at least where we can see them, most of us do not need endorsements to convince us of the value of owning a Heritage. However, because other guitarists might need one of the "guitar stars" to make them aware of the Heritage brand and/or convince them to go try out a Heritage, seeing a pro on stage playing a Heritage would be beneficial to the company and to HOC members who want to see Heritage continue making these fine instruments on into the future. As a blues fan, I found Johnnie Bassett on the cover of the Aug./Sept. issue of "Big City Rhythm & Blues" magazine. He is pictured playing his Heritage Super Eagle on Belle Isle near Detroit, MI. While this isn't a high-volume, mainstream showing, it is nice to see a Heritage both on the cover and on a few inside pages with this recording bluesman based in Detroit. But beyond this, when was the last time anyone saw a Heritage guitar reviewed or featured along with a guitarist profile in one of the national (U.S.) guitar publications over the past 25 years? What would it take for more working pros to at least try the Heritage brand? What sort of marketing changes would you recommend to Heritage to increase its brand awareness, or is mostly word-of-mouth, as it is, enough?

TruckbodyJones · September 23, 2009

Most of us who buy a Heritage guitar do so because of their playability, sound, looks, and overall quality. Because the bulk of the "guitar stars" aren't playing a Heritage, at least where we can see them, most of us do not need endorsements to convince us of the value of owning a Heritage. However, because other guitarists might need one of the "guitar stars" to make them aware of the Heritage brand and/or convince them to go try out a Heritage, seeing a pro on stage playing a Heritage would be beneficial to the company and to HOC members who want to see Heritage continue making these fine instruments on into the future. As a blues fan, I found Johnnie Bassett on the cover of the Aug./Sept. issue of "Big City Rhythm & Blues" magazine. He is pictured playing his Heritage Super Eagle on Belle Isle near Detroit, MI. While this isn't a high-volume, mainstream showing, it is nice to see a Heritage both on the cover and on a few inside pages with this recording bluesman based in Detroit. But beyond this, when was the last time anyone saw a Heritage guitar reviewed or featured along with a guitarist profile in one of the national (U.S.) guitar publications over the past 25 years? What would it take for more working pros to at least try the Heritage brand? What sort of marketing changes would you recommend to Heritage to increase its brand awareness, or is mostly word-of-mouth, as it is, enough?

As much as Heritage likes to make money and be a viable business , I don't believe they want to grow significantly. I was standing in my local guitar shop ( a Heritage dealer after seeing my guitars ) while he was talking on the phone to Heritage. The specific person I don't know ...but he was custom ordering some 150's . Basically he wanted G like parts and pickups on the guitars. The Heritage person said if you send us those parts we will put them on the guitars but not stock ....because they don't want Gibson coming after them. If they ever started cutting seriouly into G's business they would get sued just like PRS did and lost I believe. So if Heritage gets "too big" they will be on the radar. Which I think is what they have been trying to avoid all along ....just mho ....Lonnie

smurph1 · September 23, 2009

As much as Heritage likes to make money and be a viable business , I don't believe they want to grow significantly. I was standing in my local guitar shop ( a Heritage dealer after seeing my guitars ) while he was talking on the phone to Heritage. The specific person I don't know ...but he was custom ordering some 150's . Basically he wanted G like parts and pickups on the guitars. The Heritage person said if you send us those parts we will put them on the guitars but not stock ....because they don't want Gibson coming after them. If they ever started cutting seriouly into G's business they would get sued just like PRS did and lost I believe. So if Heritage gets "too big" they will be on the radar. Which I think is what they have been trying to avoid all along ....just mho ....Lonnie

+1

FredZepp · September 23, 2009

I would think that any legal issues with Gibson have already been worked out to a large degree. The Hardware is an easy area to be visually dissimilar, yet not degrade the function.

To do cost effective advertising I believe that Heritage needs to take advantage of gear reviews in Guitar Player, Guitar One, Premier guitar and the sort. And do a small , simple ad in the same issue. A really nice special issue guitar would work well for this type of review. Something that just knocks everyones socks off. I was thinking.. a Neptune blueburst H-157CM with a Maple fretboard and black blocks. Or some other nice custom finish. Maybe weight relieved. Just a wow guitar when photographed. And a nice Vintage look on a second model . Limited editions that would beg to be reviewed, then you put one in the magazines hands.... with HRW's of course.

the jayce · September 23, 2009

I personally think it takes the youth to get any type of product rolling, and the only way to appeal to the youngins is by a rock star of course. Someday heritage will probably land there forrunner(hopefully soon !) and the brand will most likely skyrocket- just like dime b-darrel did for dean guitars, or santanna did for prs, amd of course jimmy page did for gibson -heritage too will have there day, but it will take a headliner to put them on the map and it will be the young gennair to do so (just my opinion.)

Great post by the way!

smurph1 · September 23, 2009

This question keeps popping into my head..Do we want Heritage to grow? Or am I just being selfish?

Thundersteel · September 23, 2009

The same argument is often made over at the Hamer Fan Club as well. No big name endorsers (except for Rick Neilson), hardly any stores carry them, and the resale value is terrible.

I like them how they are. It leaves them to concentrate on what they do best, and not succumb to any corporate BS.

FredZepp · September 23, 2009

Do we want Heritage to grow? Or am I just being selfish?

They must be a viable business entity to survive.

But this is where I would say there are mixed motivations..: I think that as a growing business model, Heritage should be trying to increase volume and profit margins for their dealers. There is nothing like a motivated dealer base to insure success. But you can also see that maybe we, as consumers of the product, are really ok with lower margins... even really low margins.

One way to resolve this is to do the limited editions and try to create the demand and allow dealers greater margins on these, maybe even enter a MAP (minimum advertised price) agreement on these to insure that the margins are maintained. ( BTW, this is part of the reason for the success of Tempurpedic Memory Foam beds , they insure the dealer very generous profit margins. And don't allow anyone to discount beyond that.)

Doug · September 23, 2009

Interesting - if not age old - discussion.

I think a certain level of growth, without compromise to their vision wouldn't be a bad thing. I think a couple of up and coming artists endorsing and/or playing their products would be a boost without the need to change their manufacturing process or quality standards.

May I suggest Dan Auerbach of the Black Keys as such an artist who has appeal to a younger audience, yet embraces traditional - even vintage - ideals. Also his sound and style seem to be identified with his "tone", at least with me.

FredZepp · September 23, 2009

Artist endorsements are tricky, as the largest corporations have much to offer them. How about free guitars. or a profit-sharing on a signature model. Or huge exposure to the media via promotions with retailers, or sponsored concert events. Co-op advertising agreements for major national magazines. Wide distribution of your bands press kits and promotional support. Lots of things that you manager/agent is going to like.

mark555 · September 23, 2009

Heritage obviously wants to control itself as a company. Once you reach a certain size, your company becomes a monster which must be fed with production regardless, and maybe the guys at heritage don't want that.

I don't care who does or does not endorse Heritage, I buy what I want because I make my own mind up not because someone I admire play one. Why pay £3000 for a PRS santana signature model? It doesn't make you play any better and I do not want to pay royalties to some one who has far more than I ever will why buy a G Slash endorsed LP just to help pay for his coke habit? Anyway, I think some of these so called stars ought to be taking my recommendations.....

Advertising all ads to the cost of our guitars, and it will be we the players who pay more in the long run. I do not know if Heritage need to go down the advertising road, I do not know how strong they are financially.

I think Gibson surely must have known what these guys would do when they sold them the plant and machinery. Also, price fixing is illegal over here in the UK, so you can not force an agreement of margin officially or you will get prosecuted heavily. Call me an old fart, but I like things just how they are for now... Anyway, that's my 2cents worth for tonight.

FredZepp · September 23, 2009

I would bet that Heritage , like most right now, would love to increase production. It might make them have to charge more for custom services though..

We also have price fixing laws here, but tempurpedic somehow gets around it . They do not say that you can't sell their product for less, it's just that they won't sell you any more after that.

Most companies only say what you can advertise it for, true of some guitar companies, ....but not what you can sell for.

mark555 · September 23, 2009

I thought the Gibson law suit against prs was dreadful, the prs single cut design is way different from the les paul, the neck markers are their own design and the headstock totally different. I think their lawsuit was done out of fear of losing les paul sales to what is a superior guitar - the beauty of the guitar or not, is in the eye of the beholder. G lost a lot of respect from myself over that. It would be a poor day for more classical instruments if those laws were ever enforced, who would lay claim to violin or piano design?

Kuz · September 23, 2009

1. Heritage doe want to increase production (the plant is closed on Fridays due to bad economy & slightly less orders. PRS halted all nightshift, weekend, and I believe Fridays as well. Plus they just laid off 35 people)

2. Endorsements are important but have you guys forgot about Alex Scholnick? He may be the most vocal endorsee that Heritage ever has had, and what has it done for sales.... very little.

3. Be careful of what you wish for.... everyone wants Heritage to become BIGGER & MORE PUBLIC. Now look at the cost of Gibbies & PRS guitars!!! People forget that Heritage has had ONE price increase in the last 4 years (show me anyother guitar company that has offered that- PRS had a 15-18% price increase this year alone!)

I want Heritage to be successful & thrive... but I want that to happen without selling out like Gibby and I want it to happen the way Heritage does business!

TalismanRich · September 23, 2009

I only see two ways for Heritage to become a maker on the scale of Hamer, PRS, Gibson etc.

1. Start making guitars via computer CNC machines as Hamer, PRS, Gibson, etc. do now.

2. Hire 500 luthiers to hand make guitars the way Heritage makes them now.

I don't see either being a viable path. Right now they have a good niche in the market. They are custom builders of a respectable volume. They don't turn out 1000 units a day, but they put out enough to keep a select group of dealers supplied.

Kuz · September 23, 2009

I only see two ways for Heritage to become a maker on the scale of Hamer, PRS, Gibson etc.

1. Start making guitars via computer CNC machines as Hamer, PRS, Gibson, etc. do now.

2. Hire 500 luthiers to hand make guitars the way Heritage makes them now.

I don't see either being a viable path. Right now they have a good niche in the market. They are custom builders of a respectable volume. They don't turn out 1000 units a day, but they put out enough to keep a select group of dealers supplied.

+1

Let us support Heritage and enjoy them for what they are.... true American Icons and last of a generation of REAL guitar luthiers!!!

FredZepp · September 23, 2009

As Kuz pointed out they are working at under capacity right now and I'm sure would like to hire a few more to meet with an increased demand.

But yeah , none of us want them to become a BIG player. It is a question of scale to a degree . It would be nice to remain a happy , healthy , thriving company. In current conditions, it's hard to be static with zero or negative growth and maintain a healthy outlook.

Jazzpunk · September 23, 2009

We all want Heritage to be successful (enter your own definition of success here!) but here's a fact: with big artist endorsements, increased brand awareness and the resulting trendy 'hip' factor, the Heritage guitar company would have to change. Demand would rise, the business model would have to change and prices would go up.

Really the only reason to go after big name players to increase your brand awareness is so you can sell more guitars at higher costs. Maybe great for Heritage depending on their ultimate goal as a guitar manufacturer and certainly a good thing for Heritage dealers but a bad thing for a lot of the members I see posting here.

People already bemoan the 'high' used prices that sometimes come up on eBay but in actuality these prices are a steal! I'm perfectly content with the money I spent on my new 575 as it was worth every penny. Now however, I crack up when I see people making comments like, 'Nice guitar but priced high' about a hand made archtop that's listed at say $1600. That is an f'n bargain for a guitar as nice as the 575 and they usually end up going for less!!!

If Heritage ever gains the mass popularity that some hope for (and why would you want that except out of a desire to be recognized by others that your guitar is 'cool' or whatever), they will become out of reach for many, just as Gibson has become.

As Kuz has stated, enjoy Heritage for what they are. One day used and new prices may sky rocket and than threads stating, 'Remember how affordable Heritage guitars were before those trendy artist endorsements?!' will start popping up!

FredZepp · September 23, 2009

+1

Let us support Heritage and enjoy them for what they are.... true American Icons and last of a generation of REAL guitar luthiers!!!

I'm happy to do this....!! seems like there's always another "must have" Heritage on the horizon...

Dick Seacup · September 23, 2009

Based on my two visits to the factory, I don't think Heritage has ever been interested in playing the 'endorsement' game. They don't give away free instruments to musicians...except for the HOC. Yes, you read that right. As far as I know, those who endorse Heritage pay cost for their instruments; two lucky HOC members received guitars gratis. Keep this in mind when reading the next part.

There are four things a marketing manager can control. They're called the "Four Ps" and are very well known/understood by many. For those who don't remember Marketing 101 from college, they are: Product, Price, Placement and Promotion. Promotion, as a category, can have significant costs, relative to the purchase price of the product and any promotional activity needs to be considered carefully (think: break-even analysis). Breaking down the promotional 'mix' further, we generally see advertising (wow, big surprise), public relations, message, media, personal selling and a few other items. Now, I'm not a marketing guru...heck, I don't even play one on TV (or the internet)...but it sure seems to me that the boys in Kalamazoo have decided that they'd rather do a bit of personal selling as opposed to a bunch of advertising and public relations.

Based only on my few visits to the factory and chit-chat with the principals there and at the PSP, I think they're going to stick to that. They may entertain the notion of an endorser, and may even let them buy instruments at cost, but that's not where their bread and butter is and they seem to know it. Think of it this way:

From the heart of Kalamazoo, genuine tools of the trade for genuine players. If you're looking for a lifestyle, try Tennessee or Maryland.

Kuz · September 23, 2009

We all want Heritage to be successful (enter your own definition of success here!) but here's a fact: with big artist endorsements, increased brand awareness and the resulting trendy 'hip' factor, the Heritage guitar company would have to change. Demand would rise, the business model would have to change and prices would go up.

Couldn't agree more. Then people would complain about the prices and say Heritage guitars aren't as good as they once were!

Kuz · September 23, 2009

Based only on my few visits to the factory and chit-chat with the principals there and at the PSP, I think they're going to stick to that. They may entertain the notion of an endorser, and may even let them buy instruments at cost, but that's not where their bread and butter is and they seem to know it. Think of it this way:

From the heart of Kalamazoo, genuine tools of the trade for genuine players. If you're looking for a lifestyle, try Tennessee or Maryland.

+1000000000000000

Maybe the best post ever trying to explain the business model and marketing for Heritage guitars!!!!!

Very nice DS!