For those that have replaced the stock Schallers...

[Presc]

I know there are a number of threads regarding the stock Schaller pickups and suggested replacements (which I have read) but I want to ask a more specific question:

 

1) Which model Heritage?

2) What pickups did you replace the Schallers with?

3) How would you describe the change in sound from the Schallers to the new pickup? In terms of clarity, output, brightness/darkness, more/less bass/mids/treble, etc.

 

I am curious to see peoples' before/after reaction about actual experiences with the pickup. I am debating swapping mine out of my H-535.

 

Thanks in advance for any responses! And also - hello! This is my first post. This board seems like a good resource.

[mars_hall]

Not to answer directly, but it's like a woman.

 

You love her, she looks and sounds good, but another one passes in front of your eyes and you wonder, "Ooo, I wonder what she'd sound like for me". The rest falls in line.

 

1) H150 & Stat

2) Phat Cats, APH-1s, Antiquities

3) Schaller sound great to me and it all about image perception. You hear what you think you hear. It's all good but different and a variant on a theme. Get some Seth Lovers, as these have sounded the best to my ear.

 

A set of pickups will sound different on each guitar. There is no black and white, but varying shades of gray.

[yoslate]

Not to answer directly, but it's like a woman.

 

A set of pickups will sound different on each guitar. There is no black and white, but varying shades of gray.

 

And welcome, Presc! And each guitar different with each player. We are at full sail on the Sea of Subjectivity. People really don't hear the same things in the same ways. Not that there aren't benchmarks and standards.

[BrianToth]

Welcome to the forum.

 

I put Fralin P-92s in my Prospect and Sweet 16 because I love the sound of the bass strings with single coils, but hate the hum.

[fxdx99]

1) Which model Heritage?

2) What pickups did you replace the Schallers with?

3) How would you describe the change in sound from the Schallers to the new pickup? In terms of clarity, output, brightness/darkness, more/less bass/mids/treble, etc.

 

I am curious to see peoples' before/after reaction about actual experiences with the pickup. I am debating swapping mine out of my H-535.

 

Thanks in advance for any responses! And also - hello! This is my first post. This board seems like a good resource.

 

Hi there Presc, welcome to HOC. Answers to your questions:

1) H535

2) Seth Lovers

3) Schallers were very 'clean/country' sounding. Seths more open/airy/woodier. I much prefer the seths for blues-style. I'd definitely do it again.

[ingeneri]

I prefer Kent Armstrongs as a jazz guy. However, I had Seths in my old Les Paul and they were great (better than Gibbie Classic 57s).

 

A question for those who've swapped out the Schallers for Duncans. Did you have to drill a new hole since the Duncan's single screw and the Schaller double screw mountings don't match?

[smurph1]

Hi Presc..Welcome to the HOC..And now I'm going to muddy the waters even more..Yes what sounds good is a subjective matter, but I like my Schallers in my 140..i even run them through an inexpensive blues junior amp and I'm happier than a pig in mud!! I'm just gratefult to own a guitar of this quality..So experiment if you want, there is no wrong answer!!

[big bob]

575, replaced the schallers with duncan p-rails, no more howl, now I got growl..

[mars_hall]

I prefer Kent Armstrongs as a jazz guy. However, I had Seths in my old Les Paul and they were great (better than Gibbie Classic 57s).

 

A question for those who've swapped out the Schallers for Duncans. Did you have to drill a new hole since the Duncan's single screw and the Schaller double screw mountings don't match?

 

 

Already had the extra hole in the ring and the extra hole (middle) is on the ear of the Schallers I have. Takes an English thrread though for SD.

[SouthpawGuy]

I've had Schallers replaced on three Heritages ...

 

Prospect -> Seth Lovers

170 -> P-Rails

535 -> P-Rails

 

I never played the Schallers on any of them so I can't say how they compare.

[Presc]

Thanks for all the responses so far.

 

I know it's really subjective topic - because every guitar is different in the first place, and then you have to factor in different playing styles, tastes, even amps. What may be too bright into a Fender is just right into a darker amp. So I totally agree that the Schallers certainly aren't bad pickups at all. But I want to hear how other pickups are different than them. And I think that can be done somewhat objectively, so I'd like to hear peoples' experiences.

 

While myself experimenting would be ideal, sinking $260 + install (time or money for tech) is a pretty expensive experiment - and really sucks if you want to change back!

[big bob]

Thanks for all the responses so far.

 

I know it's really subjective topic - because every guitar is different in the first place, and then you have to factor in different playing styles, tastes, even amps. What may be too bright into a Fender is just right into a darker amp. So I totally agree that the Schallers certainly aren't bad pickups at all. But I want to hear how other pickups are different than them. And I think that can be done somewhat objectively, so I'd like to hear peoples' experiences.

 

While myself experimenting would be ideal, sinking $260 + install (time or money for tech) is a pretty expensive experiment - and really sucks if you want to change back!

my swap was pricey but well worth it

[t0aj15]

Wow I'm finding much of what I hear, here to be amazing. The reason being that with my 535 the Schallers were just awful, dark, gloomy, sounding p/up's (the old blanket over the speaker cab syndrome). The very first chord I struck with a new matched set of Seymour Duncan 59's was a real EAR opener (with this guitar) for me. Clear, bright, strong, full, rich, and head & shoulders above anything I ever heard from the Schallers.

[pushover]

My H157 came with schallers stock, and sounded dark and muddyin the neck PuP (which is actually considered unusual since schallers are normally considered somewhat on the bright side), and thin and unbalanced across the strings on the bridge PuP.

 

I went on a PuP hunt and pretty much drove myself insane trying different types of PuP's and listening to minute details of sound differences between them. I ended up getting 59's, but it was a really close call between them and the Phat cats. The PuP swap was no problem, and the Duncan's fit easily into the cavity that the schallers fit into. I didn't actually need to do it, but I also replaced PuP rings, with single hole rings, but the schaller Pup rings also fit just fine. I will also mention that the 59's I installed sounded differently on my guitar than they did on the test drives that I had for comparison. I actually have 59's on both my 157 and 535, yet both sound quite different. The 157 still sounds much darker on the neck PuP than the 535 does, but overall the 59's have a nice balance to them and i definately prefer them to the schallers (at least on this particular guitar).

[JoeM]

I have an older 535 that I luckily got a couple of years ago. I replaced the bridge with a TonePros tune-o-matic and stop tailpiece and replaced the Schallers with Will Boggs Vintage PAF pickups. They're a lot warmer and woodier, but they can also drive my Mesa really nicely. Tonally, they occupy this really great space in between my Les Paul and my Strat. The 535 is one amazing guitar. Remember, it's all about what sounds good to your ears.

[TalismanRich]

I haven't replaced any of the pickups in my Heritages, but I can give this comparison.

The guitars: H157 with Schallers, H535 with Schallers, Mille 2000LE with Seth Lovers. All three guitars using D'Addario EXL110s.

 

Comparing just the neck pickups tonight, the 535 was the hottest of the group. Next was the 157. Both Schallers were fatter sounding, warmer on the bottom end, but the 535 was a bit brighter than the 157 ( sounds just like Pushovers' comments). For the record, the 535 has a tune-o-matic style bridge, the 157 has the stock Schaller roller bridge.

 

The Seth Lover was the lowest output of the three. Definitely brighter, with more distinction of the notes. It took an extra number on the volume and an extra 2 on the bass of the DSL401 to get into the same region as the 535. It still seemed to retain the distinction of the notes.

 

This surprised me as there have been lots of postings about the Schallers being bright. That was definitely not the case with these guitars.

 

Your mileage may vary.

[mark555]

Hi and welcome, I hope that you enjoy joining in with the discussions. I have a fourteen year old 555, it originally had the schallers in, but I did not like them. I found them to be too harsh, brittle and they lacked smoothness - it just go's to show it's all individual taste because many guys here like them. I replaced them with a pair of Seymour Duncan '59s and the guitar sounds fantastic. All the classic rock and blues I liked was played on 59 les paul's, so I at least had something to get a comparison with. I get a lovely range of warm jazz tones that bring out the woody tones of the guitar through to great blues and rock tones, I just like them. To be honest, I couldn't afford the Seth Lovers and other high value pick ups, I found a pair on e bay in the US and bought them for £20 each, a real bargain as they are about £89 - £90 each over here in England. So price was a factor, but I had heard 59's on other guitars and they do the job really nicely for me. I also got rid of the schaller hard ware and replaced it with a more classic looking nashville bridge and matching stop piece, all hardware was replaced in nickel, looks great as well as sounds great.

 

Good luck with finding what you like, let us know what you eventually get.

[smurph1]

How to describe the Schallers on my 140..I know I keep saying I like them, but how to describe them..Mid rangy..Sound great in the middle position clean for rhythm, and then i step on the TS-9, Dyna Comp combination, switch it into the bridge position and I've got screaming sustain for days!! I know I'm in the minority, but it works for me..

[big bob]

I haven't replaced any of the pickups in my Heritages, but I can give this comparison.

The guitars: H157 with Schallers, H535 with Schallers, Mille 2000LE with Seth Lovers. All three guitars using D'Addario EXL110s.

 

Comparing just the neck pickups tonight, the 535 was the hottest of the group. Next was the 157. Both Schallers were fatter sounding, warmer on the bottom end, but the 535 was a bit brighter than the 157 ( sounds just like Pushovers' comments). For the record, the 535 has a tune-o-matic style bridge, the 157 has the stock Schaller roller bridge.

 

The Seth Lover was the lowest output of the three. Definitely brighter, with more distinction of the notes. It took an extra number on the volume and an extra 2 on the bass of the DSL401 to get into the same region as the 535. It still seemed to retain the distinction of the notes.

 

This surprised me as there have been lots of postings about the Schallers being bright. That was definitely not the case with these guitars.

 

Your mileage may vary.

 

 

How do you like the dsl 401, I love mine.. glad to hear you are liking the millie. I love the stock schallers on the psycho pop through the 401, will not swap them.

[Presc]

Very interesting response so far. It seems like response are a bit all over the map so far, which is to be expected given the subjective nature of the question. What is interesting is that you see some people have swapped them out because they think the Schallers are too muddy - while others have found them to be harsh! The before/after comparison is interesting because you get an idea of the Schallers relative to something else, but the results are a bit mixed even there. Again, to be expected.

 

For me, I have found the neck pickup in particular to be on the muddy side. I play a decent amount of jazzy stuff on this guitar, so for a lot of the chording where I want to hear each note and string ring out, I've begun to realize that I might want something with more clarity especially on those low notes. It's kind of one of those things where I dial in the warmth I want on the treble strings, and I get boomy lows, and when I correct it my highs get too brittle. And some of that low string mud also carries over into the middle spot. Since I've had the guitar for over a year now, I think I have explored most of the tone knob/pickup heigh/amp EQ options I have and at this point I am considering a swap. So it's great to hear all these responses.

 

Probably the best idea is to call a pickup winder and discuss my needs with them. I'm guessing an underwound PAF may be the ticket. I was also looking at Fralins and the unbucker could be an interesting choice.

 

Anyway, great responses so far and keep them/the discussion going! And thanks for the warm welcome too!

[pushover]

Your description of the neck up pickup exactly mirrors my own experience with the schallers. As you note though, others mention different experiences. The key issue though that it's not what anyone else says that matters, it's what you want/like that matters. Trust your ears. You know what sound you are looking for, and with some searching you should be able to find it.

[number1armadillo]

"Presc" Your comments fit exactly a situation I've noticed too on my Prospect. (Posted earlier this week) I've been considering "scatterwound" PAF Humbuckers. I don't know alot about pickup design, but from what I'm learning "scatterwound" seems the way to go. however miost scatterwounds seem to be wound by hand, and if I understand it correctly,"hand Wound" would also equal inconsistant wire winding tention and thus inconsistant tone quality from one pickup to the next. Through my research, I've come across "Tonerider" pickups which are scatterwound but by machine with consistant tention thus, being able to consistantly reproduce a same tone from pickup to pickup. Price is right too. (less than $100.00 per set) - ( sorry, I know , not a boutique price) Anyway, I'm going to give them a try.

For what it's worth.

Jon