575 feedback experiment

[JohnCovach]

There was a thread recently about controlling feedback on 575's and other hollow-body electrics. Remedies mentioned were soundposts (not so good for solid top guitars) and foam. I remembered reading somewhere that Pat Metheny used to stuff a shirt in his 175 to reduce feedback, so I got the idea: why not use a scarf?

 

The potential problem with most scarfs are the tassels at the end, so you'd need something that wouldn't have those, since they might catch on the internal wiring and/or screws. My wife suggested that you can buy fleece at the fabric store very inexpensively, so off we went. After buying way more than I could ever use for about $7, I came home and cut a piece about 51" long and 10" wide. I then fed it in the bass-side f hole of the 575; the fleece is black so you really can't even tell it's there from the front.

 

Next it was over to the rehearsal studio, where I cranked the amp using significant gain. The result was that this did take the edge off the tendency to feed back: the guitar will still feed back if you take your hands off the strings, but it won't "take off" into a howl or scream. Still the same ol' howl when using the fuzztone, however, though it's ok as long as you're playing (so maybe a noise gate would fix that some).

 

What I like about this makeshift scarf is that it's easily removed and reinstalled when needed, and can be conveniently stored in the case. And, of course, it otherwise comes in handy up here in the north during these cold winters!

 

I'll try this solution out at the next show and report back.

[LH575]

I tried a big chunk of foam. About 3 inches wide, 8 inches long, 4 inches thick. Thick enough so contact is made on the front and back.

 

Works great, really cut the feedback down. I think it looks kind of cool too. Only did it on one side, the bass side F hole.

[iim7v7im7]

Hi,

 

In terms of feedback control, I knew a player that uses Doug's Plugs with success in a big band situation.

 

Doug's Plugs are available as a product Doug's Plugs Website. They are not inexpensive (~$60) and made from high density, EVA (ethylene vinyl acetate, likely a copolymer) foam. They are custom shaped to your guitar's f-holes. They have listed of course a ES-175, but I did that they also had a H550 and Sweet 16 sets available (these may have similar f-holes but check with the factory). They can of course always make a set for from a pencil rubbing that you provide them. They "say" that they are safe for nitro finishes but I personally would not leave them in after playing a gig for long. I also have attached a PDF from Jazz Improv Magazine Jazz Improv Magazine Review.

 

If your home made solutions don't work for you. Try these.

 

Good Luck,

 

Bob

[jjkrause84]

I use old (but clean!) socks in my Gretsch....works great!

[yoslate]

We've been here before, but it's been a while. This is a good thread; thanks, John. I like the simplicity and low cost of the fabric solution. I'll occasionally get the Super into a situation where I have to work a little too consciously to keep it from doing primal scream therapy. Chunk of fabric in the case, and done. Nice....

[JohnCovach]

We've been here before, but it's been a while. This is a good thread; thanks, John. I like the simplicity and low cost of the fabric solution. I'll occasionally get the Super into a situation where I have to work a little too consciously to keep it from doing primal scream therapy. Chunk of fabric in the case, and done. Nice....

 

I had a 175 years ago with a soundpost and that worked pretty well. I like the acoustic sound of the 575 without any kind of damping, and I practice on it without the amp all the time for that reason. I've avoided the foam solution--which I've heard is quite effective, esp. Doug's Plugs--for that reason. It seems like you probably should not install and remove the foam too many times; you might end up ripping it, etc. But the scarf solution is quick and easy--like the sock solution but with less fishing for the sock when you want to remove it.

 

Maybe I should market this thing: the Anti-Feedback Scarf? Name suggestions and marketing ideas are welcome, as are financial backers!

[LH575]

It seems like you probably should not install and remove the foam too many times; you might end up ripping it, etc.

 

In the case of the foam block, this is very true. I imagine that when I remove it, it'll get destroyed in the process. Not a great solution if you want to take the solution in and out.

[big bob]

I fixed mine by switching to p-rails.

[JohnCovach]

In the case of the foam block, this is very true. I imagine that when I remove it, it'll get destroyed in the process. Not a great solution if you want to take the solution in and out.

 

The closed f holes on the Gretsch Chet Atkins guitars were designed to reduce feedback in those guitars (the ones with the f-holes painted on). I have a Tennessee Rose (Tennessean) and it does work. I've often thought it might be cool to have a little device on each f-hole that would open and close and be very low profile. You could close the f-holes at gigs and open them again when you practice. Another marketing idea!!

[iim7v7im7]

In the case of the foam block, this is very true. I imagine that when I remove it, it'll get destroyed in the process. Not a great solution if you want to take the solution in and out.

 

I would phone the manufacturer and ask them about wear from removal.

 

They are made from high density EVA foam, similar to that used in flip-flops than a soft open celled foam. The reason I questioned leaving them in is that vinyl, which is a compenent of EVA, can leach plasticizers from the plastic f-hole binding causing them to crack and or they could transfer pigment from the foam into the nitrocellulose if left in contact for prolonged periods of time.

[JohnCovach]

I would phone the manufacturer and ask them about wear from removal.

 

They are made from high density EVA foam, similar to that used in flip-flops than a soft open celled foam. The reason I questioned leaving them in is that vinyl, which is a compenent of EVA, can leach plasticizers from the plastic f-hole binding causing them to crack and or they could transfer pigment from the foam into the nitrocellulose if left in contact for prolonged periods of time.

 

I'm far less in the know about types of foam, but I have noticed that the descriptions of the cheapest guitar stands at Musician's Friend now warn "not for use with nitrocellulose finish guitars." If you have one of those stands, be careful about leaving the guitar on it for long periods of time.

 

Cheap Stands at MF

[LH575]

Funny - Gretsch has come up a few times with my past posts, by me and by others. Hmmmm. Love the Gretsch hollows, love my 575. I think that can co-exist together, right?

 

Yeah, I'm a bit concerned about the nitro finish and the foam. Will contact Ren about it this week.

 

It does work though!

 

Rock on, fellas.

[LH575]

Yeah, they can hang.

[High Flying Bird]

Maybe I should market this thing: the Anti-Feedback Scarf? Name suggestions and marketing ideas are welcome, as are financial backers!

 

Try and get Steven Tyler of Aerosmith to be the spokesman.

 

Here is what I use on my 535s.

 

 

Just kidding........

[eor]

Yeah, they can hang.

are those tru-arc brass bridges on those? if so (or not), what do you think? i have a stainless steel one on my gretsch. love it, saved me from having to replace the filtertrons. also, those p-90s (p-100s?) are pretty. what are they?

 

i'd love a giant heritage to play along with the gretsch, but i probably won't be able to afford one for a while. and they'd have to be in different configs, to assuage my guilt. they cant just be different brands or colors. maybe a longer scale, or different pickups or something.

 

as for feedback, try this: find out ahead of time where on stage (or home) you get controlled, uncontrollable and no feedback and park yourself accordingly. i use a buttload of gain at times but don't really have a problem with feedback, unless i'm looking for trouble. it also seems to me that some amps feedback more than others.

[FredZepp]

Try and get Steven Tyler of Aerosmith to be the spokesman.

 

Here is what I use on my 535s.

 

 

Just kidding........

The interior volume of the Centurion is sooo large , that I considered inflating a life raft inside. They just don't make scarfs that big.

 

 

 

( Actually , it hasn't been an issue... maybe the all maple construction helps )

[High Flying Bird]

The interior volume of the Centurion is sooo large , that I considered inflating a life raft inside.

 

Well, the joint is in Michigan so I guess Marv could talk Detroit into making an air bag for the Centurion. Have a switch to inflate or deflate.

[FredZepp]

Further experiments with the life raft idea...

[LH575]

are those tru-arc brass bridges on those? if so (or not), what do you think? i have a stainless steel one on my gretsch. love it, saved me from having to replace the filtertrons. also, those p-90s (p-100s?) are pretty. what are they

 

Both, in fact all my archtops, have the Tru-Arc Aluminum bridges. Best damn bridges on the market, in my humble opinion. The 575 has humbucker-shaped Lollar P90s.

 

Rock and Roll.

[jrfreed]

I mostly play jazz with a big band so I always have to worry about my hollow bodies feeding back...For me its all about positioning of the amp.

 

I keep it close to my chair on my right side and NEVER elevate or tilt it back, just direct the sound low and straight off the stage. Since I'm physically close to my amp, I can still hear myself but it projects really well. I think the conventional thinking is low and to the left side (with a right handed player) but I've never really had much trouble to the right.

 

Just keep playing with the amp angle...10 degrees one way or another can make all the difference.