Problem with Plek'ing a 575 Custom.....

[Kuz]

Problem is .....

 

The action is incredibly low and incredibly fast...

 

The Tone & Sustain is so much bigger and greater....

 

The intonation is spot on.....

 

 

The problem is I have no excuses, I need to get better.

 

 

 

 

 

An old dog, set in his ways, has to agree that Plek'ing a Heritage can really make a big difference. The difference is great on some guitars more than others. If you have any buzzing or feel the notes are choking (not really fretting out, but prematurely declining in volume) then Plek'ing is the best $125 you can spend on you guitar (in my humble opinion)

 

John

[iim7v7im7]

I am glad it was worth it for you.

 

I know that it was for the 3 instruments that I had done. Even with my Sweet 16 where it was "optional" that last 5% of improvement feels fabulous! When you have an acoustic done the Plek it profiles your bone saddle when it does the frets. I will have my M-38 done later this year.

[mars_hall]

Plek'ing is the best $125 you can spend on you guitar

 

Where did you have it done?

[Kuz]

Where did you have it done?

 

Weber Custom Guitars in Granville, OH (about 15 mins East of Columbus, OH). Great people!

 

http://www.webercustomguitars.com/

[Kuz]

I am glad it was worth it for you.

 

I know that it was for the 3 instruments that I had done. Even with my Sweet 16 where it was "optional" that last 5% of improvement feels fabulous! When you have an acoustic done the Plek it profiles your bone saddle when it does the frets. I will have my M-38 done later this year.

 

 

Thanks for recommending the Plek Bob!

 

Now I need to get a Polytone and learn how to play!!!

[GuitArtMan]

Glad you like the Plek job John. SOunds like you found someone who knows how to use it. As for me, well you know what I'm gonna say!!!

[Jazzpunk]

I came across this interesting account about Kenny Burrell having his signature model Heritage plek'd:

 

Article Link

 

"After the Plek process Kenny, while playing another guitar, was handed the Plek'd Super KB Model that I had just finished for him. After playing a few chords, he requested that the former guitar be set up the same."

[Kuz]

I came across this interesting account about Kenny Burrell having his signature model Heritage plek'd:

 

Article Link

 

"After the Plek process Kenny, while playing another guitar, was handed the Plek'd Super KB Model that I had just finished for him. After playing a few chords, he requested that the former guitar be set up the same."

 

No doubt it is a wonderful customized tool.

 

I personally, would like to have my guitars Plek'd after I set them up to my personal action.

 

I don't know how significant it would be to do a generalized one-fits-all Plek job. If you significantly move the truss rod, you just negated the plek job.

 

Again, I think it is best to set up the guitar to your liking & playing style and then pay to have the Plek job done.

[smurph1]

I'm a scaredy cat..I ain't messin with mine...

[hiro]

cool . . . good to know you like it . . . i heard about it and chalked it up to the the buzz feiten, true temperament, earvana kind of things but there are people like Phil Baugh or Segovia / Sabicas that never used any of that, and they play better than I ever will . . .

[Kuz]

cool . . . good to know you like it . . . i heard about it and chalked it up to the the buzz feiten, true temperament, earvana kind of things but there are people like Phil Baugh or Segovia / Sabicas that never used any of that, and they play better than I ever will . . .

 

No doubt about it that there are amazing players that play with less than ideal action, or lets just say they haven't taken full advantage of the setup possibilities.

 

But honestly the amazing players can play great on any setup, but for the mere mortals I will take every advantage I can get. And I am sold on the Plek making SOME of my guitars play & SOUND better.

[tyguy]

Hope you folks enjoyed being Plek'd!Just kiddin',Just kiddin."Ty"

[GuitArtMan]

Hope you folks enjoyed being Plek'd!Just kiddin',Just kiddin."Ty"

Well I've definitely owned some guitars that were all Plek'd up. Thank God for Michael Tuttle - he does frets right!

[Kuz]

Well I've definitely owned some guitars that were all Plek'd up. Thank God for Michael Tuttle - he does frets right!

 

A general Plek job is not the same as a Plek job after you have had the guitar, fixed the neck relief and action to your personal requirements.

 

I have spoken at length with Steve Weber about this. A general Plek job at the factory is just a decent fret job. The true benefits aren't realized until you input your own personal specs into the machine.

 

I am definiely not trying to debate who is better Michael Tuttle or a personalized Plek by an authorized Plek owner. Michael Tuttle, from what I heard, does amazing work.

 

It is just not fair to compare a general Plek job done at Gibby or Heritage to a personalized Plek job done to your specs.

[GuitArtMan]

A general Plek job is not the same as a Plek job after you have had the guitar, fixed the neck relief and action to your personal requirements.

 

I have spoken at length with Steve Weber about this. A general Plek job at the factory is just a decent fret job. The true benefits aren't realized until you input your own personal specs into the machine.

 

I am definiely not trying to debate who is better Michael Tuttle or a personalized Plek by an authorized Plek owner. Michael Tuttle, from what I heard, does amazing work.

 

It is just not fair to compare a general Plek job done at Gibby or Heritage to a personalized Plek job done to your specs.

Like any machine it's the guy running it. Give the same fret files, nut files, radius blocks, etc. to two different luthiers and you will get two different results. I'm not sure I buy the "Plek after you've fixed the neck relief, set the action, etc." My understanding is the plek is supposed to address neck relief, nut height, etc. Either way, I've had many, non-pleked guitars that came right from the factory with absolutely perfect, flawless set ups: Tom Anderson, Don Grosh, Paul Reed Smith (at least the early ones), Ron Thorn, James Tyler, Michael Tuttle, all produce guitars that from the factory play beautifully up and down the neck with no buzzing, no dead spots and that allow the customer to adjust the set up to their persona tastes. All of these guys (with the possible exception of Tyler) do this without the use of the Plek. I've yet to play a Plek'd guitar that could compete.

 

I've no doubt there are some guy's running the plek that produce fantastic results: Phil Jaccoby, Joe Glaser, Gary Brower. These are all guys that had stellar reputations before they had the Plek machine. And I've heard enough about their fretwork to know these guys know what they are doing. The point I'm trying to make is it's the man, not the machine. It sounds like you've found a shop that knows what they are doing, and that is awesome. My bet is they did fantastic work before they had the Plek machine as well. It's the man, not the machine.

 

I will say I was a little surprised your Ron Kirn tele needed a Pleking from the get go. From his reputation I would have expected better fret work.

[iim7v7im7]

I totally agree that a factory plek job and a custom plek job done by a skilled luthier are different animals all together. The difference is similar between a factory set up and a custom set up

 

A factory default plek setting does not take the time to watch you play to get a sense of your right hand technique and make adjustments to the software recommendations. It also follows the exact recommendations of the software program (luthiers use their judgement to adjust things based on the scan and the problems that are presented); and it performs the task in fewer passes. Additionally, the amount of hand polish work post plek is likely far less. So a plek is a tool palin and simple. A good one no doubt; but it only becomes a great tool in the hands of a master luthier IMO.

[golferwave]

Excellent points guys. I have guitars with both factory plek jobs and ones that have been hand done by a luthier and in my opinion from what I "feel" the hand done ones are better. I'll have to take one of my set up guitars that's never had anything done to it and have it plekked for a fair comparison.

[GuitArtMan]

I love a good debate, and I'm sorry if I come off argumentative, but I also have to laugh - at least at myself. If this were a CNC vs. hand made debate, I'd be on the other side of the fence arguing about the speed and consistency of CNC vs. hand made. And it cracks me up that some of the guys here who defend the Heritage guitars being hand made are the same guys who are praising the Plek - pretty funny don't you think?

 

But when it come to the Plek, I've yet to see the stellar results everyone is talking about. And I've owned and played several John Suhr guitars, which are considered some of the finest being made today, and who uses the plek, and the fretwork was not of the caliber as Tom Anderson or Don Grosh or Michael Tuttle imo. And I also wonder how it is that the builders I mentioned obtain factory perfect set ups without the Plek machine and they don't need me in the shop to see how I play to do it. Their guitars come out of the box playing perfect.

[Spectrum13]

So a plek is a tool palin and simple. A good one no doubt; but it only becomes a great tool in the hands of a master luthier IMO.

 

Exactly in the right hands and eyes and ears. Lucky when you have a tech a reasonable distance that can turn a factory setup into a personal one with that level of perfection. Whatever they use to do it may be driven by their embrace of technology, time management or they don't have the skill to be that accurate without the plek.

Funny, you said "Palin and simple".

 

My problem is as far as I known, Atlanta lacks a Joe Glaser, I don't have a 575 and what happens when the seasons change? Yesterday I pulled out the Millie and the neck was bowed. (temps were in the low 60's after extended cold spell) I went through a couple of truss rod adjustments and this morning its again perfect. I can't get the relief less than .006 and each time I go through a neck adjustment I'm sure the low spot is going to be a little different. So I need a cost effective compromise. I doubt all my necks will ever remain stable and 10 times $125 twice a year = almost the cost of a new Heritage not to mention the travel time and loss of use. The little skills I have enable me to take the factory setup pretty close to .078 and .63 without buzzing but I have the nuts slotted by a pro. After a couple of years, replace the nut and level and crown by a professional. But if I do get a 575, I will drive to Nashville and take the Kuz suggestion because I'm open minded and have relatives there.

[iim7v7im7]

Yup, funny...

 

And it cracks me up that some of the guys here who defend the Heritage guitars being hand made are the same guys who are praising the Plek - pretty funny don't you think?

[Kuz]

So a plek is a tool palin and simple. A good one no doubt; but it only becomes a great tool in the hands of a master luthier IMO.

 

 

Exactly in the right hands and eyes and ears. Lucky when you have a tech a reasonable distance that can turn a factory setup into a personal one with that level of perfection. Whatever they use to do it may be driven by their embrace of technology, time management or they don't have the skill to be that accurate without the plek.

Funny, you said "Palin and simple".

 

My problem is as far as I known, Atlanta lacks a Joe Glaser, I don't have a 575 and what happens when the seasons change? Yesterday I pulled out the Millie and the neck was bowed. (temps were in the low 60's after extended cold spell) I went through a couple of truss rod adjustments and this morning its again perfect. I can't get the relief less than .006 and each time I go through a neck adjustment I'm sure the low spot is going to be a little different. So I need a cost effective compromise. I doubt all my necks will ever remain stable and 10 times $125 twice a year = almost the cost of a new Heritage not to mention the travel time and loss of use. The little skills I have enable me to take the factory setup pretty close to .078 and .63 without buzzing but I have the nuts slotted by a pro. After a couple of years, replace the nut and level and crown by a professional. But if I do get a 575, I will drive to Nashville and take the Kuz suggestion because I'm open minded and have relatives there.

 

 

Again, if you return the seasonal truss rod adjustment to a reasonably close adjustment to how it was when it was originally plek's, you will have no problems.

 

You will only need to have your guitar plek'd (after the first time) after significant fret wear, like when you need the frets recrowned.

 

As far as CNC vs handmade guitars, I am not being hypocritical in the least. Let me offer this comparison. I used to play highly competiive golf. I played in College and after college for years competed in some of the better amateur events in OH (The Ohio Amateur, ect). I would be highly critical of which clubs I bought and from which companies they came from. My choice was Mizzuno clubs because they were hand forged. Well, after I bought the clubs I would take them to a local "Golf Doctor" that had highly technical equipment to make sure the lie & lofts were all correct and the stiftness of the shafts all met my personal swing speed.

 

Heritage guitar builds guitars the way I like, the Plek insures the frets are able to maintain the action I want. Same analogy as my golf equipment.

 

Almost all other golf companies used computerized molded "cast" clubs that are produced at a much higher rate and due to the casting nature would have more imperfections in the metal, those more dead spots.

 

Again, I equated mass produced computerized cast clubs to CNC'd guitars (not all cast clubs were inferior, some are quite good, but the pros play forged clubs).

 

That's my take, your version may vary.

[big bob]

A general Plek job is not the same as a Plek job after you have had the guitar, fixed the neck relief and action to your personal requirements.

 

I have spoken at length with Steve Weber about this. A general Plek job at the factory is just a decent fret job. The true benefits aren't realized until you input your own personal specs into the machine.

 

I am definiely not trying to debate who is better Michael Tuttle or a personalized Plek by an authorized Plek owner. Michael Tuttle, from what I heard, does amazing work.

 

It is just not fair to compare a general Plek job done at Gibby or Heritage to a personalized Plek job done to your specs.

I gotta disagree with you on this one Kuz, The Popsicle was pleked at Heritage and it sets up as good/ better than any guitar I've had.

Normally for a plek job the neck is set flat ie. no relief no bow. so even if you move the truss rod setting, putting it back to flat will do the trick.

 

I must also say that Katie was pretty particular about everything on the Popsicle so she might have had a better than standard job done if you know what I mean!

[Kuz]

I gotta disagree with you on this one Kuz, The Popsicle was pleked at Heritage and it sets up as good/ better than any guitar I've had.

Normally for a plek job the neck is set flat ie. no relief no bow. so even if you move the truss rod setting, putting it back to flat will do the trick.

 

I must also say that Katie was pretty particular about everything on the Popsicle so she might have had a better than standard job done if you know what I mean!

 

Well again if you chose to have no relief in the neck then Yes that plek job will work for you. I have always needed just a little relief to make bending easier.

 

But Lance think of it this way, that neck is flat for you at what string gauge, say 10s? If you use 9s or 10s detuned, the plek job will not be optimal. I am not saying that a general plek job at the factory is bad, I am saying that one done to your personal relief/action/string gauge is ideal!

[GuitArtMan]

So a plek is a tool palin and simple. A good one no doubt; but it only becomes a great tool in the hands of a master luthier IMO.

 

 

Exactly in the right hands and eyes and ears. Lucky when you have a tech a reasonable distance that can turn a factory setup into a personal one with that level of perfection. Whatever they use to do it may be driven by their embrace of technology, time management or they don't have the skill to be that accurate without the plek.

Funny, you said "Palin and simple".

 

My problem is as far as I known, Atlanta lacks a Joe Glaser, I don't have a 575 and what happens when the seasons change? Yesterday I pulled out the Millie and the neck was bowed. (temps were in the low 60's after extended cold spell) I went through a couple of truss rod adjustments and this morning its again perfect. I can't get the relief less than .006 and each time I go through a neck adjustment I'm sure the low spot is going to be a little different. So I need a cost effective compromise. I doubt all my necks will ever remain stable and 10 times $125 twice a year = almost the cost of a new Heritage not to mention the travel time and loss of use. The little skills I have enable me to take the factory setup pretty close to .078 and .63 without buzzing but I have the nuts slotted by a pro. After a couple of years, replace the nut and level and crown by a professional. But if I do get a 575, I will drive to Nashville and take the Kuz suggestion because I'm open minded and have relatives there.

You bring up an interesting observation: seasonal changes. In my case I've owned guitars that were affected by this, and others that were not. I owned a PRS Custom 24 from 1988 till I sold it in 1996; it never once needed a truss rod adjustment. In the same period of time my 1988 Gwrod Les Paul needed at least on truss rod adjustment a year, and more likely two or so. I've owned several Tom Anderson guitars, and some for many many years. None have ever needed a truss rod adjustment, yet Fenders I've owned during the same period did. Is it the finish? Is it the woods used? Is it both? I don't know, but the smaller boutique guys are doing something right in making guitars that are stable year after year after year.

[big bob]

Well again if you chose to have no relief in the neck then Yes that plek job will work for you. I have always needed just a little relief to make bending easier.

 

But Lance think of it this way, that neck is flat for you at what string gauge, say 10s? If you use 9s or 10s detuned, the plek job will not be optimal. I am not saying that a general plek job at the factory is bad, I am saying that one done to your personal relief/action/string gauge is ideal!

Kuz I go from liking 9's one day to 12's the next. I guess thats why I need so many guitars..