need info

[Patrick]

Can anybody help me understand the difference in the 150 designations? H 150, H150 Custom, H150 Classic, H150 CM. I'm probably gonna start looking for an H 150 "type guitar". Not sure if I want the H150 or the H150CM. Not sure because I don't know the difference . . . or if there evenis a difference. I have a drop dead gorgeous Gibby R9. Fit and finish are fenominally great. Playability is fantastic (obviously Plekked) great sounding too. I'm also having a LP 59 Burst clone made for me. I want to add the Heritage equivalent to my collection. I thouight I saw, here on this HOC a 150 described as "Gibby cut" it was from someone's collection who has a few 150s. That was probaly the nicest one I've seen, as I do prefer the "gibby cut" on the cutaway. But the "Heritage" cut makes it truly a Heritage . . . so I could be equally as happy with that. Thanks in advance for any replies

[golferwave]

I'll start it off. The H-150P is made of poplar and has a rosewood fingerboard with dot inlays. The H-150S (special) has a thinner body with a rosewood fingerboard and dot inlays. From there the rest are H-150CM (curly maple) The plain H-150CM had a regular (but nice) top, schaller golden 50's pickups with rosewood board and trapezoid mother of pearl inlays. The H-150 deluxe has all of the same features with Duncan pickups. The H-150 Ultra has the same features with a premium top, gold hardware, and HRW (Heritage Rendal Wall) pickups. I'm not sure about the classic.

[Hfan]

Can anybody help me understand the difference in the 150 designations? H 150, H150 Custom, H150 Classic, H150 CM. I'm probably gonna start looking for an H 150 "type guitar". Not sure if I want the H150 or the H150CM. Not sure because I don't know the difference . . . or if there evenis a difference. I have a drop dead gorgeous Gibby R9. Fit and finish are fenominally great. Playability is fantastic (obviously Plekked) great sounding too. I'm also having a LP 59 Burst clone made for me. I want to add the Heritage equivalent to my collection. I thouight I saw, here on this HOC a 150 described as "Gibby cut" it was from someone's collection who has a few 150s. That was probaly the nicest one I've seen, as I do prefer the "gibby cut" on the cutaway. But the "Heritage" cut makes it truly a Heritage . . . so I could be equally as happy with that. Thanks in advance for any replies

 

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, I think they only made the Gibby cut very early on and had to stop due to protests from Gibs.

[Patrick]

I'll start it off. The H-150P is made of poplar and has a rosewood fingerboard with dot inlays. The H-150S (special) has a thinner body with a rosewood fingerboard and dot inlays. From there the rest are H-150CM (curly maple) The plain H-150CM had a regular (but nice) top, schaller golden 50's pickups with rosewood board and trapezoid mother of pearl inlays. The H-150 deluxe has all of the same features with Duncan pickups. The H-150 Ultra has the same features with a premium top, gold hardware, and HRW (Heritage Rendal Wall) pickups. I'm not sure about the classic.

 

 

I guess that leaves me a little confused . . . there are H150CMs listed on Wolfe Guitars' web site that are gold tops and solid black tops. How could the CM designation be for curley maply? Unless Jay just calls all H150s . . . .H150CMs. I would be looking for the closest match up to a 59 LP Burst .. . Brazilian rosewood board, trapazoid board inlays, non bound head stock, curley maple Bourbon (Brock) Burst color. Maybe I need to go brand new and custome made???

[big bob]

I guess that leaves me a little confused . . . there are H150CMs listed on Wolfe Guitars' web site that are gold tops and solid black tops. How could the CM designation be for curley maply? Unless Jay just calls all H150s . . . .H150CMs. I would be looking for the closest match up to a 59 LP Burst .. . Brazilian rosewood board, trapazoid board inlays, non bound head stock, curley maple Bourbon (Brock) Burst color. Maybe I need to go brand new and custome made???

 

CM designation is for curly maple, gold tops have curly maple under the gold.

cmsm is for curly maple stag mag pickups

LW is light weight, ie chambered

 

 

150 CM custom are custom spec guitars like this

[tulk1]

Worth noting - you won't get a Braz Board unless you send the wood to Heritage. They don't use it. And won't source it. But, if you have the wood, they will make the fretboard for you. ThroBak has a 150CM with a BrazBoard. I played that guitar for quite some time. Nice feel, but to me not much dif than the really nice boards the boys are using now.

 

As for the model clarifications, it gets muddy because you can order just about anything you want, within reason. As for Jay Wolfe (and maybe he'll chime in sometime), he does a lot of special orders to his specs. Further muddying the not so clear waters on what is what.

[Gitfiddler]

If you really want a '59 clone from Heritage, it will come close, but it will not have the same cutaway, Gibson style headstock and a few other details. Heritage doesn't attempt to make a clone. That implies a copy or duplication of what Gibson is making. The instruments they are making are high quality and hand made with many available custom options, but not a copy or clone.

 

However, if you work with a Heritage dealer, you can get just about anything you want via a custom order...and end up with a fantastic, hand made guitar. Let us know what you come up with. I bet it will be a killer instrument.

[Patrick]

If you really want a '59 clone from Heritage, it will come close, but it will not have the same cutaway and a few other details. However, if you work with a Heritage dealer, you can get just about anything you want via a custom order...and end up with a killer, hand made guitar.

 

 

Thanks gitfiddler. I don't want an absolute knock off '59 clone. I have one .. . the Historic reissue R9. I'm aslo having a dead knock off made for me by a luthier (to remain un-named) that will be made to exact specs and markings. The pick-up cavities will be burned in with the date of manufacture as current, so as to denote that it is not an attempt to pass this off as the real deal. What I want is a HERITAGE, and I want it to be recognized as a Heritage. I just don't want all the other "stuff" that wouldn't be found on a real '59 Burst. I know I'm gonna need to drive up to Kzoo and have a beer with Marv. I do have a source for pre embargo KILLER Brizilian rosewood. I had a (clone) 1962, 3 color sunburst strat made for me with Lindy Fralin's in it . . . with this Brizilian wood used on the fingerboard. It's great wood. Lindy's strat pups are the best! If you look on Jay Wolfe's web site, there is an H 150, listed as "number 13". That's what I want. The only thing stopping me from pulling the trigger on that one is the sunburst shaded back and neck. Not my taste. But the top and the color . . . reminds me of the Brock Burst.

[Kuz]

Let's just say that this baby is as close as ANY guitar will come to a '59 for me.

 

Greeny is a part of my like my left n*t!!!!!

 

 

 

I other words..... yea, they can make a '59!!!!

[plexirocker 68]

Patrick I'll have a stab at it.

 

You can very easily do a special order. The Brazilian you'll have to send. Although I can tell you from personal experience from playing real "Bursts" with Brazilian compared to new Heritage you can get just as good sounding example without Brazilian. Some of those old guitars are nothin special, some are unreal. The bigger difference between G R9's and Heritages is that I don't believe GR9's use real Honduran Mah. That's a big difference, Heritages tonewoods are closer to the real deal than Historics. Again my Opinion but my 150 just kills all the Historics I've played against it and is WAY closer to the "grail" guitars.

 

The finish guy at Heritage has been there since the GREAT Gibson days, that's about as accurate as your gonna get. REAL Nitro, not what gibby uses now. They profess Nitro but there's stuff added, all the big refinish/relic, makeover guys know this to be TRUE!

 

Heck maybe just go to Jays and play a bunch

 

It's a numbers game in the end to find a great one

 

plexi

[Patrick]

Patrick I'll have a stab at it.

 

You can very easily do a special order. The Brazilian you'll have to send. Although I can tell you from personal experience from playing real "Bursts" with Brazilian compared to new Heritage you can get just as good sounding example without Brazilian. Some of those old guitars are nothin special, some are unreal. The bigger difference between G R9's and Heritages is that I don't believe GR9's use real Honduran Mah. That's a big difference, Heritages tonewoods are closer to the real deal than Historics. Again my Opinion but my 150 just kills all the Historics I've played against it and is WAY closer to the "grail" guitars.

 

The finish guy at Heritage has been there since the GREAT Gibson days, that's about as accurate as your gonna get. REAL Nitro, not what gibby uses now. They profess Nitro but there's stuff added, all the big refinish/relic, makeover guys know this to be TRUE!

 

Heck maybe just go to Jays and play a bunch

 

It's a numbers game in the end to find a great one

 

plexi

 

Firstly, let me just comment on Kuz's "Greeny" Holy shit!!! oops . . . . I apologize . .. not supposed to use profanity on HOC. Let me rephrase . . . HOLY SHIT!! That's a great guitar!! Plexi: I agree with your assessment on the Brazilian vs what Heritage is currently using, as it relates to the tone. The main reason I seek the Brazilian is the rich look and the throw-back vibe. Regarding the Honduran Mah . . .that's a new revelation for. Thanks! Why are the Heritage H150s said to be so heavy . . . upwards of 9 lbs.? My R9 is 8.25 lbs. Resonates and screams. Even when I play it dry,not thru an amp . . . it sings!! Also, I know Floyd upstairs in the finish department. He's an artist and in my opinion . . . a National treasure. Playing the guitars at Jay's shop won't help me. That's not what I'm gonna get when I special order. Mine will have it's own unique and authentic sound. It's like everything else I do . . . . I'm gonna totally over annalize this. It's gonna be real fun for me.

[golferwave]

Have fun getting the order together for your own personal "grail" ... The hard part after that is the waiting.

[big bob]

Have fun getting the order together for your own personal "grail" ... The hard part after that is the waiting.

 

 

+1

[barrymclark]

Have fun getting the order together for your own personal "grail" ... The hard part after that is the waiting.

Cue Tom Petty

[plexirocker 68]

Hey Patrick I'll pass some cool stuff on to you. I was just at Heritage last week. If you don't send some brazilian, they do have some very dark excellent low porous quality rosewood For the almost real deal as close as possible to Brazilian look and "vibe " as you put it, unless you're into "swirly Brazilian" Some of that old Brazilian was almost closer to ebony in color and texture. Or buy a junked up broke Gibsons early 60's almost anything and cull the board

 

You can get the right weight just specify. Personally I dig about 8.5-9.5

 

They do not have a long tenon but no worries the Heritage tenon pretty much goes to the front pickup and it's plenty wide and deep for good structure and sustain. Again no worries.

 

Bridge Hardware sometimes is overlooked. For most authentic tone I would go with a abr-1 and a lightweight stop tail and make sure to get the steel studs that are LONGER than the current Historics. I think tone pros may have these if not pigtail does. The real deal pauls used longer steel studs that went into the body deeper. And if you're really feeling adventurous have them thin the top to original spec. The current tops are almost 3/4 at the top middle where the original pauls were right at a 1/2 inch. So if you would do like the G guys and use a thicker top with shorter steel studs they can't possibly sound the same as the current Historic studs barely get into the Mah. body because of the current top thickness.

 

There are all kinds of pots, caps and pickups to get you close too. Just lots of personal preference. IMO Wolfetone Dr.V's or Marshallheads are the closest I've found to the real deal PAF's. Some of those old PAFS were really hot. There's a bunch of great winders that get right there.

 

Many of the Historics IMO can be loud or boomy so when your playing acoustically it seems cool. But most of the old Pauls I've thought sounded the best weren't acoustically loud at all as if more sound came from the back of the body than thru the bridge and nut from the top. My Heritages have that same type tone, once plugged in it's "bingo"

 

plexi

[plexirocker 68]

http://s106.photobucket.com/albums/m257/pl...nt=burst1_1.jpg

[Patrick]

Hey Patrick I'll pass some cool stuff on to you. I was just at Heritage last week. If you don't send some brazilian, they do have some very dark excellent low porous quality rosewood For the almost real deal as close as possible to Brazilian look and "vibe " as you put it, unless you're into "swirly Brazilian" Some of that old Brazilian was almost closer to ebony in color and texture. Or buy a junked up broke Gibsons early 60's almost anything and cull the board

 

You can get the right weight just specify. Personally I dig about 8.5-9.5

 

They do not have a long tenon but no worries the Heritage tenon pretty much goes to the front pickup and it's plenty wide and deep for good structure and sustain. Again no worries.

 

Bridge Hardware sometimes is overlooked. For most authentic tone I would go with a abr-1 and a lightweight stop tail and make sure to get the steel studs that are LONGER than the current Historics. I think tone pros may have these if not pigtail does. The real deal pauls used longer steel studs that went into the body deeper. And if you're really feeling adventurous have them thin the top to original spec. The current tops are almost 3/4 at the top middle where the original pauls were right at a 1/2 inch. So if you would do like the G guys and use a thicker top with shorter steel studs they can't possibly sound the same as the current Historic studs barely get into the Mah. body because of the current top thickness.

 

There are all kinds of pots, caps and pickups to get you close too. Just lots of personal preference. IMO Wolfetone Dr.V's or Marshallheads are the closest I've found to the real deal PAF's. Some of those old PAFS were really hot. There's a bunch of great winders that get right there.

 

Many of the Historics IMO can be loud or boomy so when your playing acoustically it seems cool. But most of the old Pauls I've thought sounded the best weren't acoustically loud at all as if more sound came from the back of the body than thru the bridge and nut from the top. My Heritages have that same type tone, once plugged in it's "bingo"

 

plexi

 

That's all real good info Plexi. I'm right there with-ya on the Tone Pros with the longer studs and locking bridge. I'll use Tone Pros for sure, and I know that Heritage already used them when spec'd. I guess I would be OK with the rosewood they have there if it is as you said. The weight is of greatest concern to me. I would hope they would accomplish that with some really dry (naturally, not kiln) Hondo Mah? I wouldn't want it chambered at all. As for the shallower dish on the top, it's good to know that Marv would be willing to do that. I agree with "all sorts of pick ups, pots and caps out there" I know that I want the bumble bee caps . . and I'm thinking of going with 250K pots for a "less hot" and more mellow quacking type LP sound. What's your thoughts on the 250 vs the 500K?

[plexirocker 68]

That's all real good info Plexi. I'm right there with-ya on the Tone Pros with the longer studs and locking bridge. I'll use Tone Pros for sure, and I know that Heritage already used them when spec'd. I guess I would be OK with the rosewood they have there if it is as you said. The weight is of greatest concern to me. I would hope they would accomplish that with some really dry (naturally, not kiln) Hondo Mah? I wouldn't want it chambered at all. As for the shallower dish on the top, it's good to know that Marv would be willing to do that. I agree with "all sorts of pick ups, pots and caps out there" I know that I want the bumble bee caps . . and I'm thinking of going with 250K pots for a "less hot" and more mellow quacking type LP sound. What's your thoughts on the 250 vs the 500K?

 

 

I like the 500's better. 250's seem to "constrict " the tone a bit . Grab you some low wind pafs and experiment with the pick up heights and you'll have it

 

plexi

[pro-fusion]

Many of the Historics IMO can be loud or boomy so when your playing acoustically it seems cool. But most of the old Pauls I've thought sounded the best weren't acoustically loud at all as if more sound came from the back of the body than thru the bridge and nut from the top. My Heritages have that same type tone, once plugged in it's "bingo"

 

I completely agree, and I'm a million miles from being a 'vintage' guitar guy. Les Pauls are not supposed to sound like a semi-hollow, IMHO. My 157 sounds like a million bucks plugged in, but sounds kind of plinky unplugged.